this post was submitted on 04 Jan 2024
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[–] [email protected] 14 points 11 months ago* (last edited 11 months ago) (2 children)

Israel was formed after Palestinians attacked them

You need to read up on the history of the Zionist movement, the map of the proposed state of Israel pre-1948, Haganah/Irgun militias, and the Nakba.

Imagine living under British Imperialism, having another group of people decide that your land is their ancestral homeland, your land is now the useless desert while your coastal home is no longer yours. Imagine not fighting back after this.

This premise is already far-fetched

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zionism#:~:text=From%201897%20to%201948%2C%20the,first%20Zionist%20congress%20was%20organized.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_Nations_Partition_Plan_for_Palestine

The proposed plan was considered to have been pro-Zionist by its detractors, with 56%[9] of the land allocated to the Jewish state despite the Palestinian Arab population numbering twice the Jewish population.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Irgun

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nakba

[–] NuXCOM_90Percent -3 points 11 months ago* (last edited 11 months ago)

The problem is that many are asking for exactly that now

another group of people decide that your land is their ancestral homeland, your land is now the useless desert while your coastal home is no longer yours. Imagine not fighting back after this.

All of the "from the river to the seas" and insistence that Israel leave is exactly this again. Because the median age in israel as of 2023 is 29.1 years old. Much like most of the people in Gaza didn't even "vote" for Hamas, most of the people in Israel had nothing to do with the bullshit in the 50s.

This is the issue with basically any "I watched a youtube" level comment on colonization and imperialism. Yes, the modern day occupants have a LOT of advantages and benefit a lot from what their ancestors did (even if it is grandpa). But is it "just" to have everything taken away and given to the people who grew up disadvantaged because grandpa was a dick?

And are you at all surprised when there is push back to that?

And that extends to how all of this is being handled. "We" have more or less learned to distinguish between Hamas and Palestine because, outside of the dumbfuck tankies, nobody is stupid enough to think Hamas at all cares about Palestinians. But there is no similar acknowledgement for the IDF/Israeli Government and the people of Israel. Instead, we get disgusting stupidity like this topic chain where "Well... I am not going to say you deserve it but you totally deserve it" is the theme at hand.

It is the exact same idea about being anti-zionist without being anti-semitic and how so much discourse is failing at that. Which... makes it a lot harder to garner the level of support that would allow politicians who are very dependent on "the Jewish vote" to make it clear they are condemning a government and not a people.

Personally? I see no way that even a two state solution can work at this point. Ignoring the issue of land and resources, it will be Hamas and Islamic State assholes who take power in Palestine and that will just be pushing this off. But I also see no way that the Israeli Government will stop at anything short of genocide. But all of this not even veiled "Well, maybe you should have thought to not be born in Israel you colonist prick" level commentary is just making sure that there is no solution other than genocide by the side with the bigger guns.