this post was submitted on 04 Oct 2023
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Speaking as a straight cis male who's on the verge of asexuality, it's been incredibly difficult and oftentimes alienating having discussions of sexuality and sexual insecurities with my other cis male friends because a lot of the discussion tends to veer into vulgarity or jesting. Then there's the conversations you have with your partners and sometimes some of those partners implying that you're not 'man enough', etc.
I understand that a lot of this is due to toxic masculinity but I've gotta say, it's been pretty tough.
Yeah, I hate how girls will be disgusted when it's somehow suggested you'd want to have sex with them, while at the same time, I don't feel like I'm even supposed to have an opinion.
It's like, I'm a man, not in a relationship, not gay and not good at pretending I've never heard of sexuality, so if I don't want to have sex with a girl, that must mean I find her extremely ugly.
"Whatever... stop talking to me. You clearly just want to get into my pants. What?!? You DON'T want to sleep with me? Why the eff not?! Am I not good enough for you? Not pretty enough?!"
Damned if you do, damned if you don't.
I married my highschool girlfriend, so I’m definitely not in the know about the dating scene… but this sounds very incel-y to me.
If you’re objectively getting this kind of response, it may be that you’re pursuing the wrong type of person, or you should work on your approach. Every person is an individual, you gotta treat each person as an individual.
I'm pretty sure, that was a hyperbole, not an actual, verbatim response. Most girls won't actually say these things, because that would say a lot more (that they're conceited). But you can often tell that they're overthinking it from their reaction, which is of course difficult to portray with words.
But yeah, it should be clarified that girls are not to blame for this. Society as a whole, both men and women, are involved in passing this non-sense continually onwards.
I don't think the person was saying they would really say that they are saying that they are pointlessly calling out the elephant in the room. As a teenage girl if you aren't a gargoyle literally every teenage boy is thinking about you sexually because that is the level of hormonal reality. It's like saying stop talking to me you just have 2 eyes and 2 arms.
Not if you are old enough. The only nice part about being in my early 40s is that when I tell someone that, "yes, I'm that picky/shallow," they seem to just accept it and move on. I'm old enough that when I tell someone "this is the bare minimum that I expect," they accept that and move on.
The only strange part for me at this point is that the bare minimum I expect is that you a) are able to take care of your own needs, just as I do, b) are keeping up with your exercise routine, and will be willing to help both of us in pushing each other to better heights, and c) you aren't vapid, and can actually hold a conversation. I'm not interested in being your professor/father/educator exclusively. I want to challenge you, just as much as you challenge me.
Literally every potential partner I have met cannot fulfill these, IMHO, pretty basic requirements. The only real benefit of being this shallow/picky is that now people finally respect my choices.
a sounds reasonable. But b and c sound like big expectations where I would doubt that I could fulfill them all the time and then I would disappoint. So these two points sound to me like a lot of pressure.
They are a lot of pressure. They are the same pressure I put on myself, so yeah. Not many people push themselves the way I do, so not many people would even want to live my lifestyle. Especially as it isn't very rewarding in a material sense.
Ah then it is fine. No judgement. I just wanted to make sure you don't underestimate their implications and your wording sounded a bit like you consider them the normal baseline.
If you want to challenge them then how are b) and c) prerequisites? Where's the challenge when it's already there? If you want to be challenged then are you ready to be challenged in areas other than that? What if someone wants you to challenge to b) eat healthy home-made food every day and c) develop the grace and skill to tame a social situation with smalltalk, instead of insisting that every verbal utterance be a philosophical dissertation?
Neither of your "challenges" are such. I already do both things by myself. I want to improve myself, not just maintain.
What happens when you two disagree on what would actually be an improvement?
A discussion, I would imagine. That's how I deal with disagreements between myself and others .
What if you judge it as vapid because it doesn't align with what you consider valuable improvement? What if it's nigh impossible to express verbally?
...all I'm saying, basically, is that there's unknown unknowns. Too much goal focus ensures that they'll always stay that way.
I was specifically thinking of a woman who recently asked me why I wear black all the time, and when I replied "Ask Johnny Cash," she got visibly confused and said, "Oh." I'd have told her to either read the lyrics or listen to Man in Black, if she'd asked. I don't know what to do with confused disengagement.
Now I can't read body language through text but maybe she had an assumption, that got destroyed, therefore she looked confused? It doesn't mean that she didn't know the lyrics or the man. Also do you enjoy being needlessly cryptic.
Engage by reassuring, or changing the topic? Cracking a joke? ("Also, I'm way too lazy to colour-match"). Whatever.