this post was submitted on 16 Oct 2024
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Fediverse

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A community to talk about the Fediverse and all it's related services using ActivityPub (Mastodon, Lemmy, KBin, etc).

If you wanted to get help with moderating your own community then head over to [email protected]!

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Learn more at these websites: Join The Fediverse Wiki, Fediverse.info, Wikipedia Page, The Federation Info (Stats), FediDB (Stats), Sub Rehab (Reddit Migration), Search Lemmy

founded 1 year ago
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I'd like to invite you all to share your thoughts and ideas about Lemmy. This feedback thread is a great place to do that, as it allows for easier discussions than Github thanks to the tree-like comment structure. This is also where the community is at.

Here's how you can participate:

  • Post one top-level comment per complaint or suggestion about Lemmy.
  • Reply to comments with your own ideas or links to Github issues related to the complaints.
  • Be specific and constructive. Avoid vague wishes and focus on specific issues that can be fixed.
  • This thread is a chance for us to not only identify the biggest pain points but also work together to find the best solutions.

By creating this periodic post, we can:

  • Track progress on issues raised in previous threads.
  • See how many issues have been resolved over time.
  • Gauge whether the developers are responsive to user feedback.

Your input may be valuable in helping prioritize development efforts and ensuring that Lemmy continues to meet the needs of its community. Let's work together to make Lemmy even better!

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[–] [email protected] 14 points 1 day ago (1 children)

I will suggest filtering, by term and by source URL. I think it would help customize individual feeds, making it easier and perhaps more comfortable navigating the news.

Example A: term filtering: This should be fairly obvious. Say I'm a Linux user who could care less about KDE. But people keep gushing over it in the Linux subs I subscribe to, and the damn developers keep pushing new releases that also get posted. Argh! Filter out posts (maybe even comments) that mention KDE, Bob's your uncle. And I can still enjoy all those delicious GNOME posts. Definitely not a real world inspired scenario.

Example B: URL filtering: Simply(!) filtering out link posts by source URL. Not a fan of Fox News and/or WaPo? Filter out one site or the other by root URL, like *.foxnews.com or *.washingtonpost.com. Me, I'd gladly filter out all and any YouTube links unseen by default. That's a constant noise generator I could genuinely live without. But I digress.

I hope the examples illustrate my point because I could clearly never explain a feature request succinctly nor to the point.

[–] [email protected] 4 points 1 day ago* (last edited 1 day ago) (1 children)

Reminds me of Custom Feeds

  • Inspired by Firefish's Antennas feature
  • Similar to Reddit's multireddit functionality
  • Follow specific users, communities, and instances
  • Include/exclude tags or keywords
  • Choose post types (posts, comments, or both)
  • Set custom feeds as default
[–] [email protected] 4 points 1 day ago

Yeah, more or less right. On Mastodon I'm a heavy filter user, so loads of terms and hashtags just GTFO. I don't see anything near that capability baked into Lemmy.

And I have to say, the more I think about it, the more important link source filtering is. Given how many posts are links to external sites I think it would be a great feature to sift out the chaff before you even have the chance to roll your eyes at it!

[–] [email protected] 8 points 1 day ago

I would like to have the ability to follow a Lemmy user, in the sense of seeing their posts in unblocked communities.

[–] [email protected] 11 points 1 day ago (1 children)

Keyboard navigation. I know about https://github.com/vmavromatis/Lemmy-keyboard-navigation but it's annoying that I have to use an addin/userscript for such a basic feature.

[–] [email protected] 2 points 1 day ago (1 children)

You can use the Photon frontend instead.

[–] [email protected] 4 points 1 day ago

Photon doesn't exactly have keyboard navigation, i've been working on it though

[–] [email protected] 7 points 1 day ago (6 children)

Seems like there's basically no effort to address disinformation. I love the idea of the fediverse, but I've never told a single person I use it in well over a year because I'd be embarrassed if they ever visited and saw some of the content that gets upvoted here.

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[–] [email protected] 6 points 1 day ago* (last edited 1 day ago) (1 children)

Has anyone suggested any feature related to word list filters? Like, blocking any community, comment, post or user with a certain term in their name/title?

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[–] [email protected] 9 points 1 day ago

There were several issues on GitHub regarding proposals on how to solve the low visibility of small instances. However, after the Scaled Sort was implemented, all those issues were closed, yet the problem persists. I continue to use Reddit the same as before because I primarily used it for niche communities, which are lacking here. The few times I've posted to a niche community here, I've either received no answers or been subject to drive-by downvotes, likely from users not even subscribed to the community. As a result, I now only post on Lemmy when the post is directed to a large community, and I use Reddit for the rest.

[–] [email protected] 8 points 1 day ago (1 children)

I think by default bots should not be allowed anywhere. But if that's a bridge too far, then their use should have to be regularly justified and explained to communities. Maybe it should even be a rule that their full code has to be released on a regular basis, so users can review it themselves and be sure nothing fishy is going on. I'm specifically thinking of the Media Bias Fact Checker Bot (I know, I harp on it too much). It's basically a spammer bot at this point, cluttering up our feeds even when it can't figure out the source, and providing bad and inaccurate information when it can. And mods refuse to answer for it.

[–] [email protected] 4 points 1 day ago (1 children)

Even large social media platforms have trouble dealing with bots, and with AI advancements, these bots will become more intelligent. It feels like a hopeless task to address. While you could implement rules, you would likely only eliminate the obvious bots that are meant to be helpful. There may be more sophisticated bots attempting to manipulate votes, which are more difficult to detect, especially on a federated platform.

[–] [email protected] 4 points 1 day ago* (last edited 1 day ago) (1 children)

For sure, it's not an easy problem to address. But I'm not willing to give up on it just yet. Bad actors will always find a way to break the rules and go under the radar, but we should be making new rules and working to improve these platforms in good faith, with the assumption that most people want healthy communities that follow the rules.

[–] [email protected] 4 points 1 day ago* (last edited 1 day ago) (1 children)

I’m particularly concerned about the potential for automods to become a problem on Lemmy, especially if it gains popularity like Reddit. I believe a Discourse-style trust level system could be a better approach for Lemmy’s moderation, but instead of rewarding “positive contributions,” which often leads to karma farming, the system should primarily recognize user engagement based on time spent on the platform and reading content. Users would gradually earn privileges based on their consistent presence and understanding of the community’s culture, rather than their ability to game the system or create popular content. This approach would naturally distribute moderation responsibilities among seasoned users who are genuinely invested in the community, helping to maintain a healthier balance between user freedom and community standards, and reducing the reliance on bot-driven moderation and arbitrary rule enforcement that often plagues many Reddit communities.

Grant users privileges based on activity level

[–] [email protected] 4 points 1 day ago

That’s a very cool concept. I’d definitely be willing to participate in a platform that has that kind of trust system baked in, as long as it respected my privacy and couldn’t broadcast how much time I spend on specific things etc. Instance owners would also potentially get access to some incredibly personal and lucrative user data, so protections would have to be strict. But I guess there are a lot of ways to get at positive user engagement in a non-invasive way. I think it could solve a lot of current and potential problems. I wish I was confident the majority of users would be into it, but I’m not so sure.

[–] [email protected] 7 points 1 day ago* (last edited 1 day ago) (2 children)

The decentralized nature of Lemmy, while appealing in theory, creates significant frustration in practice due to widespread instance blocking. Finding an ideal instance becomes a daunting task, as users must navigate a complex web of inter-instance politics and restrictions. This challenge is further compounded for those who prioritize factors like low latency or specific content policies. Lemmy's architecture heavily favors instance-level configurations, leaving individual users with limited control over their experience. The only reliable solutions seem to be either hosting a personal instance—a technical hurdle for many—or simply hoping that your chosen instance's admins align with your preferences and don't block communities you enjoy. This politicking ultimately undermines the platform's potential.

[–] [email protected] 6 points 1 day ago

I agree, one thing that should be available when choosing an instance is to be able to easily tell the blocks from instances.

Also, IMHO, 90% of instance blocks are childish drama. Lots of instances with the same world view block each other because of admins fighting, and this problem is not exclusive to Lemmy, all activitypub platforms suffer from it.

The ideal model would be instances be more tolerable and use instance block as last resort only for SPAM or Crimes. And the user itself ban what they don't want to see.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 1 day ago

Example 1: when one side wants to bully the other, but the latter does not wish this, how do you solve this problem? Defederation it is then.

Example 2: when someone claims that the Tiananmen Square massacre did actually happen, that user gets blocked from all communities, including those they have never heard of, on lemmy.ml. This is not so rare - and this is straight from the Lemmy developers themselves, i.e. a feature not a bug. It does no good to pretend otherwise.

Example 3: when people refuse to label their kiddie porn properly, others must label it for them, or risk getting into trouble themselves, bc regardless of what some other website chooses to host, the federation model says that if your instance federates with it, then it is content that you are sharing as well. Though actually, I find the Fediverse mostly friendly in how it labels NSFW content, yet it refuses to label toxicity in a like manner - e.g. the brigading attempts organized on hexbear against other communities on different instances. If only a label could be affixed to Chapotraphouse, like "beware ye who choose to enter here...":-).

I find your comment extremely biased towards your own POV and desires, but overall there is much more subtlety and nuance in interpersonal connections, e.g. sometimes women choose the bear, and rather than say that it is "silly", it might behoove people to listen to why that choice may have been made?

[–] [email protected] 7 points 1 day ago (2 children)

Downvotes are an inherently unequal proposition, as they are now implemented. This allows everything from near and dear friends who respectfully disagree to randos with day-one accounts who don't even know what a community is all about, to brigading events organized in a larger community (possibly on Reddit or in Matrix or Discord or such). e.g. iirc I can user-block someone or even an entire instance, but in retaliation they can see my profile and downvote everything I have ever done, or have a bot do so within seconds of new material coming out. Which would affect its discoverability.

Potential solutions would be to make them no longer anonymous, and/or when you block a user or an instance then they can no longer downvote that content - just like a user-level defederation. As it is now, user-level blocks are extremely weak and even notifications can be delivered by simply tagging someone's username.

[–] [email protected] 7 points 1 day ago (2 children)

There are instances where downvotes are disabled, if you don't like them you can just use an instance like that.

Downvotes are public and not anonymous, but they are hidden in Lemmy ui. Afaik you can see who downvotes your posts from Piefed or Mbin. See this thread: https://lemmy.world/post/18805474 or this: https://piefed.social/post/205362

[–] [email protected] 6 points 1 day ago

MBIN makes upvotes visible, but PieFed doesn't. The thread you linked to is about PieFed anonymising votes, so they aren't revealed on instances like MBIN.

[–] [email protected] 3 points 1 day ago (1 children)

Lemmy: exactly - so you can either have all of downvotes or none of them, by picking such an instance, but there is really nothing in-between. Yet another example of "in-between" could be to show like downvotes from only members already subscribed to the community.

Mbin iirc doesn't allow downvoting at all and instead has its own system of "reduces", which does not federate at all with Lemmy, but instead acts as just another form of it. And yes those are publicly visible, which puts it ahead of Lemmy in this respect.

Piefed does the exact opposite of what I'm suggesting, even going so far as to hide the identity of downvoters from remote admins, who may need to know such things in order to ban someone who is being consistently abusive. I don't think this is a good experiment. Anonymous polling results would be awesome though, so it depends on which type of "voting" we are talking about here.

Mostly what I mean is that someone who posts content to the Fediverse has to expose themselves in order to do that. Whereas downvoting goes against that principle, allowing someone to do what looks to 99.99% of Fedizens as an entirely anonymous procedure.

Also, a viewer can block a poster whose content they dislike and thereby never have to hear from them again, but not vice versa - the recipient has no choice but to receive votes (up or down). Except, as you mentioned, by going to an instance that disables them entirely. Which does not help all the enormous number of members already in instances such as Lemmy.world.

Hence the roles of content creator vs. viewer are unequal, skewed in favor of the downvoters having more power than the posters. Which can inhibit content creation, and given how lack of content (especially niche) is the primary issue with the Fediverse, it seems like making the roles more equal would help.

[–] [email protected] 3 points 1 day ago

Thank you for the clarification, I understand what is your issue now

[–] [email protected] 3 points 1 day ago (1 children)

A more robust approach could involve combining multiple user engagement metrics like votes, reading time and number of comments, along with a system that sorts posts depending on how they compare to their community averages. This system would be less susceptible to manipulation by new accounts or brigading, as it would require genuine engagement across multiple factors to influence a post's ranking.

Incorporating User Engagement Metrics in Lemmy's Sorting Algorithms

[–] [email protected] 3 points 1 day ago

In general I find that the comments that tend to contain the highest proportion of batshit insanity across the entire Fediverse - I'm talking reminding me of what it was like to argue with Magats on Reddit - are those from lemmygrad.ml, hexbear.net, and lemmy.ml. e.g., ignoring 90% of what I say while hyper-focusing on a single thing, which they manage to twist into sounding as if I said the exact opposite, while demanding that I provide proof of all of my points, and ofc offering none of their own proof in return, plus what "proof" is offered ends up supporting my own point rather than theirs... It's fucking exhausting.

And moreover it's relentless. So it would seem that my options are to either move to Lemmy.cafe - the only one who has defederated from all of the big 3 - or block such people one by one, or just put up with it, since user blocking those instances does virtually nothing. Also, they could easily create an alt, on let's say lemmy.world, to accomplish their anonymized downvoting fetishes.:-P

Do you recall if people are allowed to vote on your content after you've blocked them? Even if so though, those user blocks of instances (as compared to user blocks of users) would not block downvotes (they don't even block showing of content, plus notifications can even still be sent just by tagging the recipient's username), so someone who downvotes but never speaks up by commenting would go unnoticed.

Anyway, my own preferences aside, I'm trying to think of what would encourage people to post content more often, and reducing the overall level of toxicity present in the Fediverse seems like it would greatly help with that (even if that ends up being something that you have to curate yourself via blocklists, with mods and admins being unwilling and unable to keep up with such).

[–] [email protected] 4 points 1 day ago

Automatic OCR and filtering based on content in an image.

[–] [email protected] 3 points 1 day ago* (last edited 1 day ago)

Displaying profile bios more prominently and encouraging the display of them would help everyone know if the user shared links to their other accounts or other SNS links and whatnot

This would also help fellow moderators and admins know if the newly created user is a real admin/mod that created a duplicate account or is just an impersonator

[–] [email protected] 4 points 1 day ago (2 children)

Suggestion: Easy account migration between instances

Imagine you register to Lemmy.world, but realize you're missing half the content because it comes from Hexbear or Lemmygrad users. Migrating to Lemmy.ml is a solution for this

[–] [email protected] 7 points 1 day ago (4 children)

On old instance: Settings -> Import/Export Settings -> Export (as JSON), then on new instance repeat but Import (give it the JSON).

Also note that there is no single instance that is not defederated from something or another - e.g. lemm.ee that is famous for its inclusivity still blocks e.g. threads.net.

And several users of hexbear.net have indicated a desire to remove itself from the wider Fediverse (which probably won't happen, but I just wanted to point out that such matters are not always externally imposed, but sometimes arise from within).

[–] [email protected] 3 points 1 day ago (1 children)

still blocks e.g. threads.net.

Anyway Lemmy can't interact with threads.net.

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[–] [email protected] 4 points 1 day ago

Most people want to block those instances, not access them.

[–] [email protected] 3 points 1 day ago (1 children)

It seems when a user is blocked and comments on a thread, any comments under that are also blocked. It should only be blocking that user, not the thread?

[–] [email protected] 4 points 1 day ago (1 children)

It would be hard to get the context, and you could totally misunderstood the thread, e.g. from your hidden comment everyone get that replies are sarcastic, but you don't.

Maybe an "temporarily unhide blocked user's comment and replies" button to show the whole thread.

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