this post was submitted on 10 Jun 2023
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Looking for some testimonials on these setups as I'm due for a keyboard upgrade. I like the thought of spreading my arms a bit more and the external wrist rotation from the tenting. Any suggestions?

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[–] [email protected] 1 points 1 year ago (1 children)

I had an ergodox for a while. It was nice but it also did hurt more at the start but then I felt way better than with a normal keyboard. Are you experiencing RSI?

[–] [email protected] 1 points 1 year ago

Not much, probably a minor case of it if so. Trying to get ahead of it at least but also just like the thought of moving towards a more ergonomic setup

Thanks for the advice!

[–] [email protected] 1 points 1 year ago

I’m running a 40% split at work, and I’ve noticed a massive difference in back pain at the end of a long day. Having the shoulders open and rolled back improves my posture and has made a world of difference to me.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 1 year ago (1 children)

I've been usung a Moonlander for a couple of months after a friend at work lent me his Ergodox EZ. The learning curve for someone who'd been trying freestyle for 30 years was tough, but I definitely prefer it now I'm accustomed.

Most ergo keyboard users are somewhat zealous, so if you know someone who uses one, they may be happy to lend you one on a temp basis.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 1 year ago

I’ve got a Moonlander I’ve been using on and off for a while now, it’s hard to fully commit when I’m so comfortable typing on a 60% or 65%.

Agreed about people lending, I’ve let coworkers and friends borrow keyboards and even let some friends keep them because I have too many.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 1 year ago

I built a wireless Kyria keyboard late last year and love it. I went with LEDs and OLEDS (not recommended, I basically have to leave both halves plugged in if I want to use them).

They are a lot more comfortable to use than a standard keyboard IMO.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 1 year ago (2 children)

My first split was a Moonlander which I still have and use, and I love it. Then I got a Rollow and a Waterfowl (both on group buys) and I absolutely adore them.

It does take some reprogramming the muscle memory to get used to a split ortho, but it's been worth it. I can type longer without my wrists hurting, and the freedom in key customisation is awesome.

Using a split lets me keep my hands further apart, so my shoulders are back in a more natural position. That has helped quite a bit with upper back pain.

I tent the Moonlander, but not my other two. Tenting is really comfortable, but I'd recommend starting flat and increasing angle gradually since the split ortho is already a lot to get used to.

Switching to a split is also a good time to switch to another layout like colemak if you have any interest. Your fingers will be slightly confused anyway. Doing that helped me keep my QWERTY muscle memory for normal keyboards.

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[–] [email protected] 1 points 1 year ago

I've been thinking about getting a Moonlander for work. Been having some pain in my arms/shoulders/wrists after work. Would be my first split keyboard.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 1 year ago

I want a split, but I cannot yet justify buying another mech board. I've got three currently, and I use one at work, one on my personal PC, and one on my workstation/server machine. I may be able to justify it in the future if my arms/hands start hurting.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 1 year ago (1 children)

I don’t have experience with either, but I find a keyboard tray with negative tilt very helpful ergonomically. (That is, the space bar is elevated relative to the F-keys, in contrast to the “normal” tilt of keyboards.) It’s far easier for me to keep my wrists in a neutral position with one. It might be a great compliment to a split keyboard if you opt for one.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Interesting! I've dropped from the positive tilt that I had to flat/zero and liking it so far (could just be the change of pace though). Never thought of the negative tilt. Feel like I wouldn't be able to use the wrist/palm rest at all

[–] [email protected] 1 points 1 year ago

That’s part of the purpose! 😆 Many people (including my past self) tend to leave their wrists on the wrist rest while typing, causing the wrists to angle upward and create unnecessary strain. Though not everyone, of course.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 1 year ago

I have an Ergodox EZ that I use off and on. I used to use it regularly, as I mainly bought it because I was experiencing some shoulder pain.

When you bring your hands/wrists together to type on a regular keyboard, your shoulders tend to roll inward a little bit. Using the Ergodox or any split keyboard lets you open up your chest and shoulders to a more proper alignment and is much more comfortable in my opinion.

It only took me a couple days or so before I was typing at 80%+ of my normal speed on the split and ortho layout.

I haven’t used that keyboard regularly in a while since I wound up discovering that my shoulder pain was caused by my mattress (and just exacerbated by my regular keyboard). I had built out a layout that worked pretty well for me on the Ergodox, but then for the times I would travel for work I would get thrown off switching back to the normal layout of the laptop keyboard.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 1 year ago

I don't, but a coworker uses an ergodox and I've been eyeing it lately

[–] [email protected] 1 points 1 year ago

I've used a variety of split keyboards for a good number of years now, and it has made an enormous difference to the hand pain that was just starting before I switched, and also to my posture. I tried tenting too, but never really got comfy with that. I found that tenting helped me more when using higher profile split boards (i.e. with MX switches), but I preferred not tenting with low profile (Choc) switches. It's worth getting a board with the potential to tent though, as it is a very individual thing and you never know what will work best for you.

For reference, I am not a gamer, and try to avoid using the mouse as much as possible.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 1 year ago

I personally have used a self built Dactyl Manuform as my primary keyboard for the last two years or so, and it's great as a programmer. I mostly pursued it due to wrist discomfort, which has essentially disappeared since I started using it.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 1 year ago

I got a Glove80 recently and so far I love it! It took some getting used to but it's very comfortable and seems to be helping with my RSI.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 1 year ago

I got Lulu Keyboard that’s split. I was having a lot of pain from typing and this has really helped me. I think I would upgrade and get an even nicer one to be honest

[–] [email protected] 1 points 1 year ago

I suggest the Moonlander by ZSA. It checks all the boxes for me:

  • Ortholinear
  • Fully programmable keys
  • Programmable RGB lighting
  • Hot-swappable keys (the keys are not soldered onto the board, allowing you to change the keyswitches)
  • Built-in wrist support (can be detached or folded to hide it)

I've been happily using the Moonlander for over a year and can't see myself going back to a normal keyboard.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 1 year ago

I would like to try one, but I have yet to see one that comes at a price that's even remotely tied to reality. If anyone can recommend a split keyboard (assembled, not a kit) that I can buy for under $200 I would be all over it.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 1 year ago

I have the Kinesis Freestyle Edge keyboard and so far I love it. The split definitely helps in allowing my shoulders to be more relaxed. And I feel like the tilt definitely helps as well, though I wouldnt set the tilt to be too high, as it may cause issues with typing.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 1 year ago

I used to have a Microsoft Sculpt Ergonomic and recently upgraded to a Keychron Q10. Both are excellent keyboards. Both are splitted

The Sculpt is a membrane keyboard but a very good one at that. You can get the Q10 with either blue, brown or red switches. The only thing that bothers me compared to the Sculpt, the Q10 doesn't come with a palmrest. So in that regards, you need to bring your own.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 1 year ago (1 children)

It makes a lot of sense to me, although I haven't jumped on one yet.

But I refuse to use anything but a 65%, I have a seperate numpad if I need one and having mouse and keyboard closer together is already a godsend ergonomics wise, I have no idea how I could stand full size boards back in the day.

A split keyboard is already great because your arms can be in a normal position and proper tenting and tilt makes sure your wrists are at a good angle as well.

That said, most of the more "advanced" split keyboards have pretty.. unique layouts and I don't know if I'll get used to them. I also really want to keep my arrow keys and don't want to rely on layers too much, for stuff like the F keys and other rarely used functions it's fine but I don't want layers for anything that's a regular part of my workflow.

Maybe I'll just get a quefrency and see how it goes.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 1 year ago

The Microsoft Sculpt keyboard is my perfect keyboard. They discontinued it a couple months ago, but you can still find them in Amazon. Tented and split (though it’s one solid unit, so no customization) with a separate wireless numpad for exactly the reason you described. Typing on anything else makes my fingers go numb after about half an hour.

Still thinking about trying a fully customizable one someday though, but I’m not sure it’s worth the expense for me

[–] [email protected] 1 points 1 year ago

I've been using a Microsoft Natural Ergonomic Keyboard 4000 for 12 years. I broke my first one by spilling tea into it and immediately bought a second one after trying to go back to my previous keyboard. Now “normal” keyboards feel cramped to me.

One thing that's good is that it forces you to type more correctly, and if you're not a touch typer already, getting a split keyboard is a great time to learn since you're having to make adjustments anyway. I used typing.academy to learn.

My keyboard is flat on the desk and I never have problems with carpal tunnel or similar.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 1 year ago

I have 2 ergodox EZs, a homemade redox that uses Bluetooth, and a homemade dactyl manuform.

For ergonomics, I'd say these are my priorities:

  1. Split
  2. Ortholinear with staggered columns
  3. Tented
  4. Mechanical switches

The arrangement of keys on the ergodox got me to start typing correctly, and I think the split helped a lot with my posture.

I had some bad luck with my dactyl manuform, the tenting was too aggressive, and the thumb cluster was angled in such a way that it put lots of strain on my thumb. I'm currently looking at replacing that with a Ferris Sweep.

Bluetooth was a mistake, the latency was unbearable. It led to one half of the keyboard being consistently slower than the other half, so I'd constantly make mistakes. I used nice!nanos fwiw.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 1 year ago

My wife and I use the ZSA moonlander when we're not gaming. When we game we switch to regualr 60%s. I also have a custom built split keyboard that I don't really use.

For me, it saved my wrists. My wrist and forearms used to go numb after extended coding sessions while using a regular 60%. I no longer have that issue using a split.

I do recommend researching switches, as I found that using Gateron Red Inks, 45g actuation force, also added to relieving stress on my wrists. I lubed and filmed them too, which is overboard for most.

I also recommend trying different key layouts, I use Colemak DH, but Workman and regular Colemak are also good. They lower the finger movement needed to press the most used letters in English. Layouts can be changed on the hardware level on the Moonlander, allowing it to just work on any device.

https://colemakmods.github.io/mod-dh/ https://workmanlayout.org/

[–] [email protected] 1 points 1 year ago

They take a fair amount of getting used to, especially if you get an ortholinear variety. You might find yourself not really enjoying it out the gate, but it'll force you into better typing posture and you'll grow to love it over time and hate the times you have to type on a standard keyboard. I have an Ergodox and the ortholinear aspect took a while to get used to and settling into a function keys layout I liked took another good while. Expect to be worse at typing and less productive at the outset. Your hands and wrists will thank you in the long run, though.

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