this post was submitted on 13 Aug 2023
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Ironic for a country that closed their nuclear power plants to open coal ones instead
You act like anyone in Germany thinks that coal is greener than nuclear. Believe it or not, but no on does that
They are also lying by claiming nuclear is being replaced by coal. How can nuclear be replaced by coal when share of coal is also declining at the same time as nuclear is declining.
People don't care about facts. They just want to spread their uninformed hysteria about Germany.
more like theres always a huge army of german defenders when their energy sector is criticised
hows that nord stream 2 project going? very green yes
You can criticize it based on facts. Not based on lies. Of course I'm defending Germany when someone is spreading lies.
I don't care if you point out actual flaws of anything relating to Germany. Why would I accept people making false claims ?
Also Nord Stream 2 was not a German only Project. But people like you always like to ignore that fact or aren't knowledgeable enough to know that fact.
You mean the country that had to ramp up burning fossil fuels because France can't use their reactors in the summer because of cooling water from rivers getting too hot? https://www.reuters.com/business/energy/warming-rivers-threaten-frances-already-tight-power-supply-2022-07-15/
Yeah, great argument for nuclear you're making there...
I mean the only argument you need is comparing the emissions per capita of Germany to France or Sweden.
Why not Poland, Netherlands, or Belgium?
Obviously, if you compare countries without heavy industry to countries with heavy industry and ignore all context such as Germany also providing electricity to France when their reactors need to shut down again, claims are easy to make. Those claims don't hold any water but people like the French can pat themselves on the back for successfully chasing away much heavy industry to China and Poland and let other countries count towards rising emissions because French reactors can't run in hot summers.
I did compare countries with heavy industry. And with a lot of nuclear + renewables in their energy mix specifically, that's the argument. Could have included Spain too.
Go right ahead and compare them too. What do they have in common? Still burning a lot of fossils maybe?
Sure, buddy:
https://www.macrotrends.net/countries/ranking/manufacturing-output
https://kafkadesk.org/2019/12/02/central-european-countries-among-most-industrialized-economies-in-the-eu/
Germany has 49% renewable energy, France 20%. Nuclear is not renewable and even worse for the environment than CO2. Germany still needs to burn fossil fuels when it needs to fill in all the time for France's shut-down reactors.
Failing to keep production domestic and then relying on imports via cargo from other countries is not good for the environment: https://www.worldstopexports.com/report-card-for-trade-surpluses-and-deficits-by-country/
I specified per capita. You don't like it, you can look at carbon intensity instead. Whatever way you want to spin it, Germany is still doing much worse at decarbonisation than its neighbours using nuclear power.
Wow. Demonstrably false. You're either mad or you've fallen for the decades of fearmongering from the oil megacorps.
Nuclear plants emit only water vapor, waste is contained and isolated. Unlike fossil fuel waste which goes directly into the atmosphere and kills millions of people a year. While being directly responsible for bringing us to the brink of climate catastrophe, putting billions more at risk. You need to get some perspective.
Amazing. "Demonstrably", huh? So where is it? Considering that you refused all the time to actually back up your claims with citations, unlike me, I refuse to continuing engaging with you. Edit all your posts to include evidence and you can be taken seriously. Until then: Ba-bye.
Where did I refuse? The whole argument is comparing Germany's emissions to countries with nuclear- and renewable-based grids and you completely sidestepped it with some handwaving about industry. You provided no claim for nuclear being worse for the environment than fossil fuels. Coal literally emits more radioactive waste than nuclear, straight into the environment. Regardless, I'll indulge you:
Carbon intensity of European countries:
https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0306261921012149#s0085
https://ourworldindata.org/grapher/carbon-intensity-electricity?time=latestยฎion=Europe
Safety of energy sources (and nuclear specifically in second source):
https://ourworldindata.org/safest-sources-of-energy
https://web.archive.org/web/20130404145453/http://www.nrel.gov/analysis/sustain_lca_nuclear.html
https://www.zmescience.com/feature-post/technology-articles/sustainability/renewable-energy/safest-forms-of-energy-05022022/
OK, continue to not acknowledge the fact that Germany needed to increase fossil fuel burning because your safe darling French nuclear reactors have to be shut down all the time in hot summers. You're so full of lies. Handpicking data points, usually without even backing them up, and then spin up a tale of how there is one singular evil in Europe now nuclear is so eco friendly.
Nuclear waste is safe, got it. No problems at all storing it for the next 100,000,000 years. Just pour it onto a football field and be done. Perhaps volunteer your backyard for that (bet you won't!). Soil didn't need to get removed from sites Chernobyl because it's so insanely dangerous. No, just fake news. Nuclear is safe. The entire ecosystem in Chernobyl and Fukushima wasn't harmed for generations, because when we look at the data and see that Chernobyl workers wore nuclear hazard suits and therefore relatively few died proves how "demonstrably false" reports like https://theconversation.com/at-chernobyl-and-fukushima-radioactivity-has-seriously-harmed-wildlife-57030 and https://www.smithsonianmag.com/science-nature/forests-around-chernobyl-arent-decaying-properly-180950075/ are.
What cherry picking? Carbon intensity takes that into account, it's normalised data. And the environmental impact includes Fukushima and Chernobyl. It is the most generalised data possible, unlike yours.
But if you do want to cherry pick Fukushima and Chernobyl, which of course are the only things you can cherry pick, since they are very literally the only disasters in 80 years of nuclear power with environmental impact, you should compare them to disasters caused by fossil fuel. If you don't want to be accused of being biased, that is. The Exxon Valdez alone devastated sea life and ecosystems in an area of 2000 km of coastline (20x times larger than Chernobyl and Fukushima combined!). But then there's also the Deepwater Horizon spill, and dozens of others more. And that's just oil spills. Oil, coal and natural gas have their fair share of disasters too. And that's without counting climate change exacerbated wildfires, hurricanes, and other "natural" disasters. Fossil fuels are in a whole nother level of environmental destruction compared to the other energy sources.
And I would have absolutely zero qualms about storing HLW casks in my backyard, so long as I was paid for having less space to grow my peppers and tomatoes.
Oh what a sursprise that a country who has no final storage for nuclear waste decided not to produce more nuclear waste instead of just putting it somewhere and hoping the barrels will not leak again.
The mistake was not closint down uneconomical and toxic nuclear power plants. The mistake happened years before. It was selling out our solar tech to China
Nuclear waste is not the reason they're closing, it's purely political. You could fit all of the high-level waste Germany's ever generated on a football field, and be able to walk around without any protection, getting less radiation dose than in an airplane. Let's not spread disinformation.
@Claidheamh @Draedron wrong.
Currently in storage is 130k cubic meters of radioactive waste. Stop with the fake news propaganda.
Did you reply to the wrong person?
@Claidheamh I have no idea. Sorry. Mastodon is new to me
Why do people like you constantly spread lies lmao. Coal usage is dropping despite not using a tiny amount of nuclear anymore.
Funny how people are down voting my comment regardless that it is the truth.
Here for the uneducated people:
https://www.ise.fraunhofer.de/en/press-media/press-releases/2023/german-net-power-generation-in-first-half-of-2023-renewable-energy-share-of-57-percent.html#:~:text=Coal%2Dfired%20power%20generation%20also,to%2020.1%20TWh%20in%202023.
Stats say coal share is dropping after nuclear shut down yet people online claim nuclear is being replaced by coal.
Energy from coal production fed to the grid got to 33% in 2022 from 30% in 2021 according to the Federal Statistical Office of Germany (+8.6% YoY)
It's not very representative to compare just two data points. If you look at a larger time window you can see that black coal is declining and brown coal is more or less constant https://www.energie.de/et/news-detailansicht/nsctrl/detail/News/stromerzeugung-rueckblick-auf-den-energiemix-seit-1990-zeigt-die-risiken-uebergrosser-dynamik
And most of that was to compensate the lack of french export to the European grid and not because Germany shut down nuclear.
Look at 2023 data for example.
https://www.ise.fraunhofer.de/en/press-media/press-releases/2023/german-net-power-generation-in-first-half-of-2023-renewable-energy-share-of-57-percent.html#:~:text=Coal%2Dfired%20power%20generation%20also,to%2020.1%20TWh%20in%202023.
https://www.usnews.com/news/best-countries/articles/2023-02-24/these-countries-have-sent-the-most-aid-to-ukraine
Germany is the second biggest supporter overall according to those numbers.
Which country are you from and why is it most likely further down the list?
Why even bother. The person you replied to doesn't care about facts. They probably also get medical advice from morons on Facebook.
Maybe instead of posting fake news on Lemmy you should inform yourself. Otherwise you just look like a fool. Germany is not replacing nuclear with coal. Germany is also a net exporter of electricity. And yes Germany opted to increase share of coal and gas in 2022. Guess why ?
Because french nuclear was underperforming and the European electrical grid was at risk. So no Germany didn't replace nuclear with coal.
Stats clearly show a decline in coal share that has been long ongoing. And no shutting down those last few nuclear reactors is not reversing that trend.
https://www.ise.fraunhofer.de/en/press-media/press-releases/2023/german-net-power-generation-in-first-half-of-2023-renewable-energy-share-of-57-percent.html#:~:text=Coal%2Dfired%20power%20generation%20also,to%2020.1%20TWh%20in%202023.
It just so happened they decreased the amount of nuclear output due to retarded reasons and increased the production of coal based energy. Not a replacement tho.
HANS! THE FRENCH NUCLEAR POWER IS AS UNDERPERFOMING AS THE FRENCH IN GENERAL. START SUCKING NORDSTREAMS LIKE YOU OWE THEM MONEY!
Brother germany is the representation of everything thats wrong with european energy markerts, consumption and production. No matter how you spin it, germans for no good reason at all shut down their nuclear plants in favour of fossil fuels from coal and gas from rus*ia. Germany is, again, a failed state.
Based on your writing style you seem to be very young. Hopefully one day you will be mature enough to understand that your current thought process is lacking in understanding of basic things.
If he is very young, that only makes him more justified in his anger.
Being justified in anger doesn't mean you should spread lies. It's dumb