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Hamas blocks foreign nationals from leaving Gaza (www.telegraph.co.uk)

submitted 1 year ago by [email protected] to c/[email protected]

236 comments fedilink hide all child comments

"Officials said that Israel and Egypt were prepared to let foreigners leave the Strip which is under heavy Israeli bombardment, but Hamas had refused."

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[–] [email protected] -2 points 1 year ago (2 children)

Israel has killed dozens of Hamas leaders, but way more fighters. There's no way to know exactly how many, since Hamas doesn't even pretend to put out numbers that separate civilians from combatants.
The 8k number also comes from Hamas, the same people who said that 500 people died in the hospital explosion (and blamed it on Israel). Go see the estimates literally anybody else made. All of these numbers come from Hamas.
That 8k number also includes all deaths, not just at the hands of Israel, but at the hands of PIJ and Hamas themselves. Hundreds of their rockets have landed in Gaza, and they've been known to execute their own. They really love to blame Israel for these deaths, though—not just in the case of the hospital when they can make up a specific cause, but in the cases you've never heard of where, oh, there's rubble, what caused it, don't worry.

The death of each Palestinian civilian is a tragedy. Hamas provoked the war, Hamas is killing as many of them as anybody. Israel is engaged in remarkably precise targeting of enemy combatants and places an entirely unprecedented effort into warning them when they're about to strike.

This is urban warfare. This is what Hamas called for.

[–] [email protected] 7 points 1 year ago (2 children)

The 8k number is confirmed by many organizations. The whole idea that the number is disputed comes from American politics.

[–] [email protected] -5 points 1 year ago

It’s amazing that Israel is always the victim, yet never does anything wrong.

[+] [email protected] -8 points 1 year ago (1 children)

The 8k number is confirmed by many organizations.

name one.

[–] [email protected] 9 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Here's a list: https://www.reuters.com/world/middle-east/despite-bidens-doubts-humanitarian-agencies-consider-gaza-toll-reliable-2023-10-27/

I bolded them for you

U.N. and other international agencies say there can be small discrepancies between the final casualty numbers and those reported by the Gaza health ministry straight after attacks, but that they broadly trust them.

"We continue to include their data in our reporting and it is clearly sourced," the U.N. Office for the Coordination of Humanitarian Affairs (OCHA) said in a statement to Reuters.

"It is nearly impossible at the moment to provide any UN verification on a day-to-day basis."

Dr Mike Ryan, Executive Director of the Geneva-based World Health Organization's Health Emergencies Programme, said last week figures released by both sides "may not be perfectly accurate on a minute-to-minute basis, but they grossly reflect the level of death and injury on both sides of that conflict."

New York-based Human Rights Watch also says the casualty figures have generally been reliable, and that it has not found big discrepancies in its verification of past strikes on Gaza.

"It's worth noting that the numbers that are coming out since October 7th are generally consistent or within logic for the scale of killings one would expect, given the intensity of bombardment in such a densely populated area," Omar Shakir, Israel and Palestine Director at Human Rights Watch, said.

"Those numbers are in line with what one might expect, given what we're seeing on the ground through testimony, through satellite imagery and otherwise," he told Reuters.

[–] [email protected] 8 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Dan probably blocked you for that one.

[–] [email protected] 8 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Nah. Maybe he'll come to his senses? Or maybe the UN is antisemetic?

[–] [email protected] 6 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago)

Oh dang, someone else got a memory too :)

[–] [email protected] 2 points 1 year ago (2 children)

The 8k number also comes from Hamas, the same people who said that 500 people died in the hospital explosion (and blamed it on Israel). Go see the estimates literally anybody else made. All of these numbers come from Hamas.

You know this is propaganda right? That number never came from Hamas go find them quoting it as fact, I'll wait.

The number came from an interview with a doctor right after the attack and it was mistranslated on Aljazeera. Other news agencies never fact checked it and ran with the number attributing it to Hamas.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 1 year ago

The number of casualities there was 471. 500 is an acceptable estimate.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 1 year ago (1 children)

(sorry, I don't know why I never posted this, I have way too many tabs open)

You know this is propaganda right? That number never came from Hamas go find them quoting it as fact, I’ll wait.

Well, let's see, where did the Telegraph get its 8,000 number from?

On Sunday the Hamas-controlled Gaza health ministry claimed the death toll among Palestinians passed 8,000, with most of them women and children.

... gee, I didn't even have to dig one layer deep, the Telegraph itself tells you it's from Hamas. =/

Let's focus on the 500, though, who cites the number as a Hamas claim verified by literally nobody else?

https://www.nytimes.com/2023/10/19/world/middleeast/gaza-hospital-blast-deaths.html

And who else commented on the number?

the Al-shifa hospital director, who estimated it was half of that.

But Hamas just knew in less than 20 minutes, somehow, that it was 500.

The number came from an interview with a doctor right after the attack and it was mistranslated on Aljazeera.

Does the doctor work for Hamas?

Gee, I wonder how a Hamas employed doctor managed to count 500 dead bodies within 20 minutes. Israel is still trying to tally its dead, but Hamas managed to pronounce 500 people dead just in time to falsely accuse Israel of attacking the hospital on Al Jazeera?

[–] [email protected] 0 points 1 year ago

I thought I blocked your genocide apologizing ass... well that's fixed now.