this post was submitted on 02 Jul 2023
33 points (90.2% liked)

Autism

6662 readers
210 users here now

A community for respectful discussion and memes related to autism acceptance. All neurotypes are welcome.

We have created our own instance! Visit Autism Place the following community for more info.

Community:

Values

  • Acceptance
  • Openness
  • Understanding
  • Equality
  • Reciprocity
  • Mutuality
  • Love

Rules

  1. No abusive, derogatory, or offensive post/comments e.g: racism, sexism, religious hatred, homophobia, gatekeeping, trolling.
  2. Posts must be related to autism, off-topic discussions happen in the matrix chat.
  3. Your posts must include a text body. It doesn't have to be long, it just needs to be descriptive.
  4. Do not request donations.
  5. Be respectful in discussions.
  6. Do not post misinformation.
  7. Mark NSFW content accordingly.
  8. Do not promote Autism Speaks.
  9. General Lemmy World rules.

Encouraged

  1. Open acceptance of all autism levels as a respectable neurotype.
  2. Funny memes.
  3. Respectful venting.
  4. Describe posts of pictures/memes using text in the body for our visually impaired users.
  5. Welcoming and accepting attitudes.
  6. Questions regarding autism.
  7. Questions on confusing situations.
  8. Seeking and sharing support.
  9. Engagement in our community's values.
  10. Expressing a difference of opinion without directly insulting another user.
  11. Please report questionable posts and let the mods deal with it. Chat Room
  • We have a chat room! Want to engage in dialogue? Come join us at the community's Matrix Chat.

.

Helpful Resources

founded 1 year ago
MODERATORS
 

They are not the same thing, even if a lot of people try to use them both interchangeably.

The modern form of autism as a diagnosis is born in the 1930s, when behaviorism is a dominant force in psychology. Behaviorism seemed pretty useful back then: while you can break a steam engine down to its individual pieces and study them individually, the study of the human brain presents 'a few' more difficulties. In that context, studying a person's behavior and their reactions to different interactions and environments did beat all other alternatives. The problem is that it's still a pretty limited approach. Is this person breaking down because they're tired? Or because they're sick? Or do they want to draw attention, or did they have a tough day before coming here, or are trying to manipulate their way out of-? You cannot truly know from the lenses of behaviorism, because you cannot (or could not) study the mind's internal state. However, the people working in the field still needed to justify their own salaries, so if they managed to get any results, they could claim they were making progress. We've been carrying a lot baggage from this period, one of the most harmful of which would be ABA therapy.

While the contemporary criteria to diagnose autism has improved somewhat, we can still find the traces of behaviorism everywhere through the psychiatric profession. I was recently watching someone take an online test (which, naturally, should only be used as an exploratory tool, but still points out to criteria used by doctors contemporarily or a few years ago, if you want to be optimistic), and a lot of questions are fairly questionable:

  • Others have told me that I have trouble managing my anger.
  • I have a tendency to yell at people when I feel frustrated or stressed.
  • I am often beset by feelings of sadness.
  • I rarely experience happiness or joy.

All of these questions make perfect sense for a behaviorist: all of these traits form part of a list of observed signs of a disorder widely studied, so they should belong to the same category as all the others. There is a significant problem though: how can you discern between traits inherent to the person's natural tendencies, and natural responses to a hostile environment? It can get pretty difficult for someone who suffers systematic discrimination to live a fulfilling life, but that's no reason to claim that ethnic minorities who suffer from racism are naturally predisposed towards anger or depression.

It is a given in autistic communities that autism is inherent to a person's personality. The scientific community has some trouble to take the last jump to that conclusion, because even though research often finds strong evidence of genetic inheritability, it isn't possible to predict an autism diagnosis in its current form from genetics alone. I posit that that just isn't possible, because the criteria to diagnose autism is an unholy amalgam of traits inherent to the individual and social/environmental maladaptation, which is not the same thing that we here refer to when we speak of autism as a neurotype.

top 5 comments
sorted by: hot top controversial new old
[–] [email protected] 7 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Really interesting post! I’m new here at c/autism so forgive my ignorance on the topic. What other views on psychology exist? What is a better way of diagnosing autism that avoids behaviorism altogether?

[–] [email protected] 6 points 1 year ago

What other views on psychology exist?

I'm not an expert on psychology, but this looks like a good summary: https://www.verywellmind.com/psychology-schools-of-thought-2795247

What is a better way of diagnosing autism that avoids behaviorism altogether?

In an ideal world, I'd say just look directly at brain processes, but both science and technology are still a few decades away from allowing us to do that, and even when it becomes possible, it may initially not be economically accessible. Failing that: if there are signs of autism, explain to the patient what are the differences in cognition and communication between people on the spectrum, NTs, and other NDs; locate the environmental factors that might be tipping the balance one way or the other; and help them identify which experiences they feel closest to.

[–] [email protected] 3 points 1 year ago

Thanks! It's a good summary. Behaviorism is the approach on what we see and we will correct it. It's completely superficial and will never go in deep and look behind the appearances. Autism is all about the invisible, and often about very small details making huge differences. I would say autism is part of the personality and the identity, as well as the culture of the person.

[–] [email protected] 2 points 1 year ago (1 children)

IDK

Like science is bases on a more rigid and solid based than philosophy and I feel it would be wrong to just start making definitions and such without a base as solid as scienc, what prevents from unintentionally include Shy NTs or left open a gate for those NTs to wish to identify as autistic because spurious reasons?

And if "not needing to use one of the sleeves in my shirt" is a useful criteria to find people with one arm, even if in a "monoarmical" society wouldn't be the case, wouldn't make that much sence to disregard it.

[–] [email protected] 2 points 1 year ago

Like science is bases on a more rigid and solid based than philosophy and I feel it would be wrong to just start making definitions and such without a base as solid as scienc

That would be fair if you were talking about 21st century physics. Contemporary psychiatry? Not so much.