this post was submitted on 15 Sep 2024
431 points (96.5% liked)

Games

32934 readers
1180 users here now

Welcome to the largest gaming community on Lemmy! Discussion for all kinds of games. Video games, tabletop games, card games etc.

Weekly Threads:

What Are You Playing?

The Weekly Discussion Topic

Rules:

  1. Submissions have to be related to games

  2. No bigotry or harassment, be civil

  3. No excessive self-promotion

  4. Stay on-topic; no memes, funny videos, giveaways, reposts, or low-effort posts

  5. Mark Spoilers and NSFW

  6. No linking to piracy

More information about the community rules can be found here.

founded 2 years ago
MODERATORS
 

As someone who grew up playing games like World of Warcraft and other AAA titles, I’ve seen how the gaming industry has evolved over the years—and not always for the better. One of the most disturbing trends is the rise of gacha games, which are, at their core, thinly veiled gambling systems targeting younger players. And I think it’s time we have a serious conversation about why this form of gaming needs to be heavily restricted, if not outright regulated.

Gacha systems prey on players by offering a sense of excitement and reward, but at the cost of their mental health and well-being. These games are often marketed as "free to play," making them seem harmless, but in reality, they trap players in cycles of spending and gambling. You don’t just buy a game and enjoy its content—you gamble for the chance to get characters, equipment, and other in-game items. It’s all based on luck, with very low odds of getting what you want, which leads players to keep spending in hopes of hitting that jackpot.

This setup is psychologically damaging, especially for younger players who are still developing their sense of self-control. Gacha games condition them to associate spending money with emotional highs, which is the exact same mechanism that fuels gambling addiction. You might think it's just harmless fun, but it’s incredibly easy to fall into a pattern where you're constantly chasing that next dopamine hit, just like a gambler sitting at a slot machine. Over time, this not only leads to financial strain but also deeply ingrained mental health issues, such as anxiety, depression, and a lack of self-control when it comes to spending money.

Countries like Belgium and the Netherlands have already banned loot boxes and gacha systems, recognizing the dangers they pose, especially to younger players. The fact that these systems are still largely unregulated in many other regions, including the U.S., shows just how out of control things have gotten. The gaming industry has shifted from offering well-rounded experiences to creating systems designed to exploit players’ psychological vulnerabilities.

We need to follow Europe’s lead in placing heavy restrictions on gacha and loot boxes. It’s one thing to pay for a game and know what you're getting; it's another to be lured into a never-ending cycle of gambling for content that should be available as part of the game. Gaming should be about fun, skill, and exploration, not exploiting people’s mental health for profit.

It's time for developers and legislators to take responsibility and start protecting the players, especially the younger ones, from these predatory practices.

(page 2) 50 comments
sorted by: hot top controversial new old
[–] SuperSpruce 4 points 3 months ago (1 children)

The interesting thing is that although I've almost never spent money on a gacha system and haven't played much gacha systems recently, my brain subconsciously craved for more but in a safer way.

That's why I created the JavaScript weighted playlist for myself: A random selection of songs from my music library where some songs play (much) more than others. Getting a super rare song is akin to getting a top tier drop. Additionally, the playback rate is randomized to a normal distribution, giving the tiny chance that a rare song can play with a wild playback rate. And if that wasn't enough, some Geometry Dash related songs can randomly skip to the next song, simulating watching someone try to beat some demon level.

I've created a skinner box for my brain that sometimes causes me to waste hours just clicking on the "next song" button to see what shows up next. My wallet was not harmed in the process (although it might soon be because I want it to work on a portable device, but that money would go to some niche open source hardware thing rather than a greedy gacha publisher).

[–] [email protected] 3 points 3 months ago

This is extremely interesting and in general kind of touches on a point that I heard that's kind of funny... People are just bored, and all of Good and bad things that we do in this world are a result of that boredom. Gambling, our hobbies, picking up another job. If it cures your boredom there's nothing wrong with it

[–] [email protected] 3 points 3 months ago (3 children)

Is roblox a gacha game? My little 7 year old nephew wants to play but I'm not sure if it's appropriate (as the gaming liason in the family)

[–] [email protected] 2 points 3 months ago

I wouldn't call Roblox itself a gacha game. That category is the ones where you are trying to collect all the heroes in the game and level them up with rare loot. AFAIK they generally, if not always, involve loot crates that you have to purchase.

Roblox has its own problems. As spelled out by People Make Games in these two videos.

https://youtu.be/_gXlauRB1EQ?si=ngjtGwhA5JH5FcEL

https://youtu.be/vTMF6xEiAaY?si=u1z_LYfOYrOMlUDd

Roblox claims to teach kids how to make their own games. At this point from what I've heard, I would suggest Unity Engine before Roblox, and I wouldn't recommend Unity after their pricing debacle.

Watch the videos, and have a serious discussion with his parents about it before you get him that game platform.

load more comments (2 replies)
[–] [email protected] 2 points 3 months ago (1 children)

Countries like Belgium and the Netherlands have already banned loot boxes and gacha systems

Did they really? I certainly know that the lootboxes aren't allowed here (rip my TF2 weapon paints), but I still could spend 10 euros on Genshin Impact, even if I had to use MasterCard.

load more comments (1 replies)
[–] [email protected] 2 points 3 months ago* (last edited 3 months ago)

The problem is the new wave of gacha games are really selling you on characters and Hoyoverse isn't even hiding it anymore: The more money you pour into Zenless Zone Zero, the less clothes the Proxy wear in the unlockables. And they have characters for every sexual preference on Earth at this point.

[–] NuXCOM_90Percent 1 points 3 months ago (6 children)

While I definitely have a lot of issues with how fast people said "Gacha and loot boxes are okay if it is Genshin Impact", I have the same general reservations I did back when it was about loot boxes in Overwatch or nu-Battlefront 2.

Yes, it is real shitty and a great way to pad out a game into a grind. And the goal is obviously to encourage RMTs to bypass it.

But also? It is like people for got ARPGs and MMOs and the like. The common refrain among older "gamer" Millennials is something like "I almost flunked out of school because of WoW/Everquest" and the like. And a lot of us have stories about staying up all night doing Bhaal runs to get a specific drop in Diablo 2 and so forth.

And, at the end of the day, it is the same thing. It is a way to artificially increase engagement with the option to RMT your way out of it. Studios have found ways to pull all those RMTs into the game itself (so that they get a cut on every legendary sword sold) but it is still the same skinner boxes.

Not to mention games like Balatro or Vampire Survivors that take massive inspiration from casino and slot machine design and mechanics. Yes, they don't have additional purchases (DLC aside) but there is something to be said when EVERYONE owns a ten dollar game because everyone who touches it can't stop gushing about the flashing lights and bells.

And, much like with loot boxes, I am really hesitant for any "We passed some random ass legislature. Mission Accomplished(TM)". When the underlying skinner box concept is still the basis of so many games.

[–] [email protected] 4 points 3 months ago (7 children)

While there certainly are problems with other games, at least every game you mentioned is fully transparent about the price tag. Balatro doesn’t exploit whales by concealing how much it'll cost to get anything.

[–] NuXCOM_90Percent 4 points 3 months ago (1 children)

And thank you for demonstrating how we got here and why the root issue will never be addressed.

"Whoa now. The game I like does none of that" is the same reason gacha is fine if it is genshin

[–] [email protected] 4 points 3 months ago (1 children)

They're different issues. The fact that people can and do financially ruin themselves over gacha is a lot more serious, and trying to conflate that with something like Balatro ultimately muddies the message.

I think gacha is a predatory business model that should be illegal, and yes that includes Genshin. But no it does not include Balatro, because Balatro isn't gacha.

[–] NuXCOM_90Percent 2 points 3 months ago* (last edited 3 months ago) (1 children)

Its the same idea. It is taking concepts that are known to prey on those with addictive tendencies and turning that into a game.

That is why I referenced games like Diablo and WoW. They were more about making people spend time but.. time is money.

And THAT is the problem. Knowingly taking advantage of the kind of stuff that rubs dopamine emitters real nice. Because a lot of us can dip in and out of a gacha and not get ruined. And others will fail out of college because they NEED that drop

[–] [email protected] 2 points 3 months ago (1 children)

It's not. These are not the same thing. No one has bankrupted themselves playing Balatro.

[–] NuXCOM_90Percent 2 points 3 months ago* (last edited 3 months ago) (1 children)

Money is not everything. That is why I keep pointing out the time argument (and you keep ignoring it...). Gaming cafes tend to take advantage along those lines but also just look up horror stories like that couple that was so engrossed with WoW (?) they let their baby die.

At the end of the day: Warning labels and acknowledgement of what we are exposing ourselves to goes a long way. Rather than just saying "I like X so X can't be bad" until it gets to the point that people insist it needs to be illegal because they cannot help themselves.

load more comments (1 replies)
load more comments (6 replies)
[–] [email protected] 3 points 3 months ago (2 children)

but there is something to be said when EVERYONE owns a ten dollar gam

Because it's the game of the year.

load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (4 replies)
load more comments
view more: ‹ prev next ›