this post was submitted on 13 Sep 2023
64 points (95.7% liked)

Asklemmy

43336 readers
870 users here now

A loosely moderated place to ask open-ended questions

Search asklemmy 🔍

If your post meets the following criteria, it's welcome here!

  1. Open-ended question
  2. Not offensive: at this point, we do not have the bandwidth to moderate overtly political discussions. Assume best intent and be excellent to each other.
  3. Not regarding using or support for Lemmy: context, see the list of support communities and tools for finding communities below
  4. Not ad nauseam inducing: please make sure it is a question that would be new to most members
  5. An actual topic of discussion

Looking for support?

Looking for a community?

~Icon~ ~by~ ~@Double_[email protected]~

founded 5 years ago
MODERATORS
 

The only term I could think of is defeminization.

It seems like most people understand what emasculation is and the things that cause it.

What are some examples of situations that can cause the feeling?

Edit: changed effeminization to defeminization.

all 31 comments
sorted by: hot top controversial new old
[–] [email protected] 54 points 1 year ago (3 children)

Infertility/miscarriage, menopause, loss of breasts or uterus to cancer, perhaps being unable to attract a partner or being 'friend zoned', trouble bonding with child maybe caused by ppd, loss of hair, accidently mistaken as being a man, failure at traditionally seen as women's work such as cooking or keeping a clean house

And I'm not sure effeminization is right. When I hear that, I think of a feminized male, not a defeminized female.

[–] [email protected] 21 points 1 year ago (1 children)

I’ll add: growing “excess”, unfeminine hair.

I’m old enough to just pluck as needed and not care all that much, but there are definitely times when I feel like there’s something wrong with me because I can feel two or three hairs on my chin.

[–] [email protected] 5 points 1 year ago (1 children)

No one ever mentions to you as a young girl going through puberty that there’s another one coming in your late 20s-early 30s that will cause you to subconsciously stroke your neck/chin upwards and make smirky faces in your mirror to catch all these hateful manly hairs.

I do this and I see women at stoplights doing this all the time now. But no one clued me in to it as a preteen that it was coming, and that’s rude.

[–] [email protected] 7 points 1 year ago

Yeah that all sounds accurate. Ps. The word I had in mind was defemenization, my bad.

[–] [email protected] 6 points 1 year ago

People should pause and realize for many men emasculation is: having someone decide what burger they are getting without consulting them, a spouse that earns more money, and having to look after their own children. We have some work to do.

[–] [email protected] 37 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (1 children)

Emasculation happens when 'feminine behaviour' in men removes pervieved power and agency and makes them feel degraded. Bare in mind, weakness is considered a feminine behaviour.

What removes power and agency from women is not us displaying masculinity, it's having our gender and sex used against us and/or against our will.

So being percieved as overly emotional/unstable, sexually promiscuous, not capable of intelligence or leadership, etc. and being raped and physically manhandled.

That is what is degrading to women.

[–] [email protected] 10 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Thats an interesting take.

I was working under a different understanding where emasculation is humiliation due to lack of 'traditional masculine trait' and the inverse hence being humiliation due to lack of 'traditional feminine trait'. I just found it interesting that that is not smth much talked about.

[–] [email protected] 3 points 1 year ago (1 children)

I was working under a different understanding where emasculation is humiliation due to lack of ‘traditional masculine trait’

Men who lack 'traditional masculine traits' or behave in 'un-manly' ways are referred to with what sort of language?

What are the humiliating comparisons made to these men?

[–] [email protected] 4 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Sissy, cucks etc there's a million terms out there.

[–] [email protected] 2 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago)

Think about why is it demeaning to call a man a 'sissy'. What is that comparing him to?

And calling a man a cuck is emasculating because it implies he is weaker than, and controlled by, who?

[–] [email protected] 36 points 1 year ago

The fact that there’s not an easily defined name for it should tell you something.

The long and short of it is that emasculation is what happens when people think someone isn’t acting enough like “a man,” or is stopping someone from doing so.

In women, it’s generally acting too much like a man. Getting called “shrill” or “aggressive” is something that frequently brought against women who take an assertive role. I’ve also seen women who were in senior positions asked to take notes during a meeting, as if they were a personal assistant rather than a manager.

Emasculation is treating a man as less than a man. As if he were a woman. The equivalent for a woman is treating her like society has traditionally treated a woman. Our current best word for that is probably “misogyny,” but we can unfortunately also go with “normal.”

[–] [email protected] 28 points 1 year ago

Masculation would be the opposite of emasculation. Masculine women are seen as butch, bull dykes, stuck up c*nts, etc., the same way feminine men are seen as weak, gay, sissies, pussies, etc.

[–] [email protected] 23 points 1 year ago (2 children)

A flat-chested female friend of mine was bullied by her female peers as a teen; they called her "A-cup", especially around boys.

[–] [email protected] 7 points 1 year ago

I've wondered about this before. Given my experience as a male teenager, I do not know how I would have coped with an aspect of puberty being so prominently visible and literally front and center. Males obviously have the whole penis size thing, but its an organ entirely out of sight in public. Your story sounds awful!

[–] [email protected] 2 points 1 year ago

That's a particular brand of cruel.

[–] [email protected] 8 points 1 year ago (1 children)

It is not a very commonly used word, but I think the word you are looking for is "defeminize" - it's the closest 'clinical' English word I've heard - every other word to describe the feminine equivalent of emasculation is either slang or a slur.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 1 year ago

Yep, that was a brain fart right there.

[–] [email protected] 6 points 1 year ago

A bit of a different take on this are the sworn virgins of Albania. They give up their femininity, reproductive and sexual identity and are treated as male in every way.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Balkan_sworn_virgins

[–] [email protected] 6 points 1 year ago

I’ve looked into this before and there is no word or equivalent phrase for what you’re talking about.

Effeminization is more about men seen as too feminine so it’s not it.

Inadequacy as a woman/girl is I guess the closest. There are idealized forms you’re pushed to be like when you’re growing up and into adulthood. Breasts are probably the closest stand-in for testicles in this context but it’s not a perfect one.

[–] [email protected] 6 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Shakespeare used the word "unsex" for this, I think. It's been a while but maybe Lady Macbeth was an example?

[–] [email protected] 3 points 1 year ago

Wow I didnt expect this answer!

"Come, you spirits That tend on mortal thoughts, unsex me here, And fill me from the crown to the toe topful Of direst cruelty!"

Now the removal female qualities is the desire of the character herself as she wants the spirits to remove her feminine qualities and emotions, so I dont know if this would count since the lack of traditional gender traits is a positive or atleast desired aspect.

But great reference, I would never have thought of that.

[–] [email protected] 4 points 1 year ago

body shaming. making fun of small boobs, big boobs, uneven boobs, put your nipples away, etc. you're always too skinny or too fat. the perception that women need to be protected.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 1 year ago

What if your kids bond to a female friend and start calling her Mommy instead of you?

[–] [email protected] -4 points 1 year ago

There is no equivalent because women are culturally allowed to enact both gender roles without taking on shame.

The shame a man is assigned when he either adopts or is cast into the feminine role is a asymmetrical aspect of our gender culture.