Huh, after spending years not developing EV technologies?
I mean good luck to them, but I don't see this coming soon. Tesla is still far ahead in pure EV technologies (talking about supercharger network but also engines power and efficiency)
this post was submitted on 13 Jun 2023
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I had the same thought. They'd like to become leader but they've moved way too slow. They're a good 10 years behind.
But they're a big company. Perhaps they can turn things around.
I hope so ! We still need a 1998 Camry equivalent in an EV.
Well there is the Chevy Bolt. Which is a very good deal on a pretty good range EV. But yeah... It's still a Chevy
Fair, but basically not sold in Europe.
Yes, very good point there.
Will actually Toyota had the best tech for many years did hybrid cars employing batteries and electrical engines.
I'm not so sure that they're behind in terms of know how for EV, quite the opposite actually.
Hybrid != Full on EV. Especially their goal are opposite : the EV part of a hybrid drivetrain needs power density (smoll battery and engine needs lotta HP) whereas full EV drivetrain need energy density/efficiency (moar range)
Wasn’t their CEO that constantly downplayed EV’s in favour of hybrids and hydrogen?
Yeah was looking for this comment, what happened to those hydrogen engine promises?
To add to what @[email protected] said, there isn’t any push for hydrogen infrastructure, while EV charging infrastructure is being subsidised in every continent. It might have its use in large scale industry applications or as a battery for solar & wind, but I don’t see how hydrogen will be the future of the personal automobile.
Hydrogen engines just seem like a push for consumers to continue being dependent on fuel suppliers and also parts and aervice suppliers for an overly mechanical engine.
Don't batteries that have set recharge lifespans continue supplier dependency as well? I'm not sure which would be cheaper honestly, having been looking at lithium prices for a while now.
That is true but they should last for 20 to 30 years. Basically the life of the car. Better to make an informed decision every 20 years than be at the mercy of what is available at that moment.
It was because the math on carbon pollution from EVs showed their hybrids were better for the environment compared to the manufacturing CO2 emissions in making batteries.
Toyota is being brought to the EV market kicking and screaming because it's not actually better for the environment.
At least that's what I read. I'll be honest I'd not have a source off the top of my head so take it with a grain of salt.
I never really bought that argument, because sure, an EV car has co2 emissions during manufacturing, but then so does an ICE car.
Also it really downplays the consequence of having fumes being made by the tons in our cities have on our health and the surrounding ecosystems, so, to me, that was always a “we invested too much into our hybrid tech and don’t want to go anywhere else until we have made alot of profit” talk.
I also vaguely remember what OP was talking about. It was also factoring in how dirty the energy was being produced was at the time. So if you add electricity is projected to be dirty for x decades plus the environmental cost of the battery manufacturing. But they probably redid the calculus recently as coal plants have been shutting down way faster than initially predicted.
Took the time to try to find more info on this.
Apparently it came from a 90 minute talk by a Toyota Australia executive. And the assumption is that the power grid supplying the BEVs are dirty in comparison to the hybrids which reduce CO2 in their power generation/efficiency.
https://evcentral.com.au/ev-versus-hybrid-toyotas-co2-hype-analysed/
This really smells of bullshit because it really doesn't have anything to do with choosing one or the other.
We should be choosing BEVs and also putting tremendous effort on the power grid to go renewable energy.
I've come full circle on this statement after reading some more.
Haha ok. After years of claiming that everyone should just drive hybrids and spending billions on oil lobbying, they now think they’re going to leap forward on everyone else’s head start?
Love to see them try.
So they're going to double their battery's range in 3 years time ? Uhuh.
I'll believe that tech when I see it. Panasonic, BYD and LG Chem have spent literally decades incrementally improving batteries, and spending many billions on it over the years.
So unless this is a battery tech they're bringing in from one of the battery powerhouses then I'm hugely skeptical that Toyota can suddenly magic up a breakthrough when they've had their battery tech outsourced to date.
Toyota were once a leader and are now seriously behind the curve. I can't imagine a company who is still hedging their bets with hydrogen can get back in the lead. At absolute best they can manage to survive while sliding down the sales charts every year
Don't underestimate them. They do hold the most number of patents in solid state battery. They weren't exactly sitting idle over the past few decades.
Former glories: like I said, they once were a leader.
They're not now, and it's damn hard to catch up when you've fallen behind.
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