I just want to make funny Pictures.
this post was submitted on 14 Oct 2024
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Why wouldn't you though?
Because then artists aren't getting paid but you're still using their art. The AI isn't making art for you just because you typed a prompt in. It got everything it needs to do that from artists.
So it's more of an ethical "someone somewhere is probably being plagiarized and that's bad" thing and not really a business or pragmatic decision. I guess I can get that but can't see many people following through with that.
Some people got mad at a podcast I follow because they use AI generated episode covers. Which is funny because they absolutely wouldn't be paying an artist for that work, it'd just be the same cover, so not like they switched from paying someone to not paying them.
The issue is similar to using other people's data for profit. It's easy to not feel that's the case because "it's the AI that does that, not me."
There's a lot of concerns around it. Mine is that we have longer periods of style with minimal variety because of artist stagnation due to lack of financial backing. Though, this is for all gen AI as it depends on humans for progression, else it stagnates. People are already getting AI art fatigue because it feels like that old 2005–2015 Adobe Illustrato vector art everyone was doing, because it is. It was an incredibly popular and overused style back then, so itt' brimming with it in comparison to other art styles it got from the internet. It already looks dated, but acceptable because it's familiar to most. It depends on more artists progressing our art to be able to do the same. But it won't do that as fast if art culture is slowed due to lack of support.
Remember when corporations tried to claim that money you didn't spend on their product was theft ? This way of thinking has been recycled by the anti-AI bros.
Turns out all the money you don't spend on struggling artists is not only theft, but also class warfare. You stinking bougie you.
Because that's a harm to society and economy.
It's gutting entire swaths of middle-class careers, and funneling that income into the pockets of the wealthy.
If you're a single-person startup using your own money and you can't afford to hire someone else, sure. That's ok until you can afford to hire someone else.
If you're just using it for your personal hobbies and for fun, that's probably ok
But if you're contributing to unemployment and suppressed wages just to avoid payroll expenses, there is a guillotine with your name on it.
Please don't use the "but it creates jobs" argument.
Me shitting in the street also "creates jobs" because someone has to clean it.
It feels like you're directing that at me, but I agree with you, so I'm not sure what tone that was written in
I think what matters if you would've otherwise hired someone. Otherwise I can't see it making any impact.
And in a lot of cases you would've paid for stock photo company anyway
I don't agree:
Before if you chose not to hire someone, you'd be competing against better products from people who did hire someone. Hiring someone gave them a competitive advantage.
By removing the competitive advantage of hiring someone, you're destroying an entire career path, harming the economy and society in general.
A lot of AI use I'm personally seeing is shit most wouldn't spend money on or stuff where instead of paying for a stock photo they just generate shit and be done with it. Would they have ever paid someone to do the work and especially would anyone have agreed to do such small work that'd never pay anything reasonable, most likely no.
I guess I don't believe in quite as much in the invisible hand of capitalism. I rather think it's a race to the bottom with companies buying some cheap slop to use on their webpage or whatever from a stock photo company and now people pay AI companies for it, if anyone. Can't see the big impact of that sort of shit being replaced.
I also think capitalism is a race to the bottom, but I believe it is so because it subverts the value of labor. It's shit like AI that makes it a race to the bottom.
Then pay for the stock photo. There, an artist is being paid for their work. But realistically the little stuff you're talking about is the occupation of entire departments in megacorps.
Paying a stock photo "artist" or some AI slop "artist", I'm not sure it makes any difference. The stuff AI generates is already so sloppy generic corporate bs that it's hard to think of anyone deserving to paid anything for it anyway. It's mimicking a horrid generic art style and a horrid generic art style like that isn't owned by a particular artist anyway.
Honestly that's kinda worse, because it's specifically replacing entry-level jobs
Replacing jobs in one place and giving them elsewhere. It is what it is.
It's not giving them elsewhere.
There is not and will not be an abundance of prompt "engineering" jobs, it's not creating new industries, and it's not significantly lowering the bar for people to start their own businesses is existing industries.
What it is doing is data-mining on a scale never seen before, and increasing profit margins for megacorp business owners.
AI is a huge growing industry with a lot of jobs. Now instead of some corporate slop "artist" it's some corporate AI "prompt artist" doing work (albeit behind the scenes). That's just how it goes. And I'm sure some jobs die off but that has always just been how it is, not as many jobs in coal mining either as there used to be.
As someone who is part of the problem (working on creating AI products, too scared to quit in protest) I can promise you that is not how it works. That is a frighteningly naive and short sighted view of the repercussions.
Coal mining was bad, and using coal was bad.
We found a replacement for it, which is good. some people were affected, which is bad. But replacing coal had a minimal impact on the overall job market and was a huge benefit to society.
AI is taking away safe skilled jobs from people who love them. It's affecting many industries, and will affect many many more if you can actually believe the promises of the LLM providers.
First it's affecting the fine arts. Beginner illustrators, authors, etc, can't compete, so they leave the industry. After all the old hands die out, there is nobody left to replace them.
Then it's affecting technical industries; software development, hardware design. Same thing, eventually nobody will be left.
Finances and accounting, of course
Then medicine. And there is a knock-on effect here where areas that AI cant do are also affected because the industry as a whole is on the decline so nobody bothers to even apply - you usually start school as a generalist and specialize later.\
And the new "prompt artist" jobs being offered are orders of magnitude fewer and less gratifying.
If what you said was true, then there wouldn't be any benefit to corporations, and they wouldn't be investing billions into it.
All this would be ok if the fruits of this new advancement went back into society, to help people, especially those who were displaced. But it doesn't. It goes straight into the pockets of business owners and shareholders in the form of increased margins and stock buybacks.
You're literally arguing that we should just let big business interests walk all over the job market because that's "just how it is".
I'm saying more that nobody is going to go out of their way to artificially save those some corpo art people and such jobs. It's just new tech making some jobs obsolete while moving some workforce in to other things. There will be luddites but it's not going to stop the change.
Calling people against the current incarnation of AI "luddites" is a gross mischaracterization.
I'm glad that you seem to have at least completely given up the pretense that this will somehow benefit society.
Im telling you that again that the jobs that AI makes are orders of magnitude fewer, and far less fulfilling.
I'm telling you again that the impact goes way beyond corpo art jobs.
But youre refusing to listen, or even put up a reasonable defense, you're just reiterating your previous completely unsupported assertion in really suspicious ways.
Nobody is trying to argue the feasibility of stopping the change, we're saying the change is bad. The argument that the change is inevitable therefore it is good (or that at least we shouldn't be upset by it) is crazy
I don't know if it's that different from the real life luddites. Maybe the word has a different connotation in where you live, I don't know, but I did mean it in a slight negative but mostly meaning "workers against the change".
I think it might benefit society (as in I don't know), but I don't think I've ever been optimistic about that. I think things in general will keep getting worse.
I don't know how I was saying the change is good or what was suspicious about what I said, I guess that's more meta conversation but if you don't mind I'd like to know
Luddites were against automated looms because they thought it'd destroy the careers in the industry.
They were right, it's just that working a loom was a small enough part of the economy that it didn't really matter.
AI is like that, except for every creative or technical career in every industry. It promises to replace all jobs where people are provided creative or intellectual challenge. Nearly every middle class job. Assuming that LLM providers can actually deliver on their promises. But why do we even want to allow them to try?
The owner class gets the lions share of the benefits and none of the drawbacks. The middle class gets almost no benefits, meanwhile their wages get suppressed and the job market gets wrecked.
Even if you're right and this will create new industries, which I'm skeptical of, displaced workers need to retrain at their own expense. How many people, in the middle of their careers and with families, can afford to just start again in a new industry with entry level salaries? And do you know how tough it is for an older person to advance in a new career?
And even then, even if people could afford to switch careers mid-life; where are those careers? Those hypothetical new industries are going to take decades to mature let alone to even be created in the first place. How much unemployment do you think the economy can stand up to for decades?
It's suspicious because you seems like you have a vested interest in AI or in making AI appear positive.
You seem to be framing AI as good for us normal folks, and that the only people at risk are those who do shitty work. That there is some kind of benefit for people to have and that the risk is so negligible that it's fine.
But it's frustrating because you can't seem to describe these benefits, or why the risks are negligible, or even worth it. You just keep steadfastly asserting that it's ok. So where is this conviction coming from and what is the motivation to continue to assert it?
It's just that I really doubt anything can be really done about the advance of AI. Either it fizzles out or it actually delivers, and if it seems like it will deliver you won't get people putting that genie back in the bottle. It's just going to happen because there could be so much potential there, if it delivers.
You have a weird reading of my comments, no offense. I think you're so upset at AI that anyone not being as hostile you take as positive and pro-AI. It happens, especially online, I wouldn't worry about it too much, but it can just make discussion hard.
How am I supposed to read
If not positively, even when qualified by "if it delivers"?
you're saying that delivering will provide lots of potential. Unless you're saying that the potential youre talking about is potential harm, in which case I agree but that's a strange way to phrase it.
Right from the start of this thread you were justifying it saying that it's fine for it to displace workers because the workers being displaced were not doing work of value. When I laid out why it's still a bad thing, you switched arguments to "it's inevitable so there is no point complain".
Which is a strange take, because it's totally normal to complain and air grievances about inevitable things that you don't like. You seem really committed telling people to stop complaining about AI. It's weird
You yourself said how it could replace all jobs and whatnot. If the tech was a dud then that wouldn't happen. That's the potential in it.
I think it's fine to complain, nobody is stopping you lol. I was just saying that if it delivers on that potential then it's going to be used no matter what. That's just how it goes, even if it is upsetting.
That's bad potential. Replacing workers is bad. It's not good for society or the real economy. So again, why frame it positively?
Why bother tell people who are complaining that what they're complaining about is inevitable?
I guess you can complain about the inevitable complaining about an inevitable bad thing. But that's a weird thing to do, without an ulterior motive.
Potential in tech doesn't mean the consequences are positive.
Because it's just part of the discussion..? Friend, you might be taking discussion on Lemmy of all places a bit too seriously.
👎 weaksauce
That's the spirit
I take it back.
Your part of the discussion was to actively suppress discussion, so your reasoning that it was "just part of the discussion" is bullshit. Do better.