this post was submitted on 15 Aug 2023
312 points (90.4% liked)
Lemmy.ca's Main Community
2814 readers
1 users here now
Welcome to lemmy.ca's c/main!
Since everyone on lemmy.ca gets subscribed here, this is the place to chat about the goings on at lemmy.ca, support-type items, suggestions, etc.
Announcements can be found at https://lemmy.ca/c/meta
For support related to this instance, use https://lemmy.ca/c/lemmy_ca_support
founded 3 years ago
MODERATORS
you are viewing a single comment's thread
view the rest of the comments
view the rest of the comments
Probably get banned for this comment but all of the rights we have were taken via violence. Nothing else is going to stop feudalism in this country except violence. That guy threatening landlords is, like it or not, correct
Not that I want to go killing people, but that's quite literally the only way change is made throughout all of human history
How many Canadians had to take up arms and murder their countrymen to get gay marriage and cannabis reform? The other side certainly used a lot of violence, AND THEY LOST. I only have to come up with one counterexample and there's two.
That's it. That's all there is to it. It is true that some rights took violence to establish, but clearly there are plenty that didn't. If for example it takes violence to fix our housing problems, then I guess that's what would have been needed, but there are plenty of options before we get there.
Yes violence can be both successful and unsuccessful but to begin with the state likely used violence against violent supporters of bad drug policy and bigoted marriage laws, or alternatively against covid deniers and what not. On the other hand people did riot for weed and gayness 50 or so years ago and continually violently defended themselves in their continued (political) existence for these years. Political change, even if the laws change relatively non violently at the end, needs violence or at least the threat of violence to come about.
You're moving the goalpost. We're talking about executions. Fucking terrorism. That is NOT the way social causes are advanced.
No I'm describing the world and how I understand Political progress. Protests, strikes, riots, civil war, terrorism, assassinations, police and military violence and war can all be used, and are primarily used to further political goals. Politics is, viewed from some perspectives at least, the struggle about who can use what kind of violence for what reason. Specific to the landlord example, the police will use violence to enforce the landlords property rights through eviction, sure there is a system that justifies that violence, it is still violence.
Looking at what Abes assassination did to political development in Japan. especially toward Abe and the Unification church seems to provide good reason to assume terrorism to be pretty effective at the moment. ISIS, black Panthers, the end of the British Raj, the existence of the country of Turkey its all violent power struggle for political goals all the way down. If you are a freedom fighter or revolutionary or a terrorist is literally just a matter of perspective.
I'm just trying to get you to realize that Violence is used by all political sides and that their own justifications for it are never perfect. You might find yourself supporting violence by the(your) state and violence from other groups on different issues, both are violence nonetheless. I generally agree executions for achieving political goals shouldn't be needed, at the same time they do happen regardless, and you can separate good political goals from bad ones, and welcome the executions that further your political goals, without endorsing executions generally.
You're not advocating for violence, so why would you be banned?
We don't want to prevent reasonable discourse with opposing opinions, we just don't want an army of trolls and (literal) shit posters overwhelming everyone else.
Is he not? He said only violence gets anything done and "that guy threatening landlords is, like it or not, correct." I guess you could be extremely generous with assuming he likes society exactly as it is?
He's edited his comment and I'm pretty sure it wasn't that aggro when I read it last night, unless I was really that tired.
Sorry, I got the impression that you ban whoever you disagree with
My god, what a martyr
What childish nonsense. You have no absolute rights as a member of a society. Every right is limited and every law limits a right. Virtually none of those were passed through violence.
Do you not know how Canada became a country??
If you think laws will be peacefully passed that grants housing to all Canadians you are delusional
156 years ago?
Dude, it's time to move on.
It's time for a revolution actually
It's time for change. We are a long, long way from revolution.
Well I am not a long way from living on the street lol
One person is not a revolution.
There are hundreds of homeless people in my small city of Victoria alone
Ever been to Vancouver?
Yes. I'll be there in the middle of September.
A few hundred homeless people do not a revolution make (or a few thousand, or a few tens of thousands.) You can fantasize about it by the reality is that you end up dead or in prison if you try.
We need change, that is an absolute truth, but we are a long, long way from revolution.
Ok well just wait till you see how aggressive and violent homeless people have become haha. It's not friendly begging anymore and I don't blame them
Agree that it's fantasy though. Canada is spineless
I'll be fine.
Yeah you sound wealthy so you will likely just avoid those areas entirely
I was thinking that I would go down to Save On for a sandwich.
I don't blame them either. However this problem exists in a country where homeownership sits over 60%. Many, many of them not in any proximity to homelessness. It'll require a lot more people on the bandwagon to get a significant change happen.
You know what's funny? I mentioned going down to Save On Meats to get a sandwich and you didn't even know that it had closed permanently during the pandemic. You were telling stories like you were from there and you were lying. You've probably never even been there. I have. I've walked those streets. My cousin works those streets. You're afraid of outrageous stories you've read online, probably in the extreme right wing echo chamber. How utterly fucking pathetic
You said Save On which I thought you meant save on foods
Holy hell why are you so angry
Your reply is so weird. Even if I understood you meant the diner I wouldn't have known it closed anyway because I can't afford to eat at restaurants in the first place
I'm not even slightly angry. I'm quite happy, actually. I just landed in Vancouver.
Ill take that bet.
Ok...what's the timeframe? 1 year? Complete revolution, right? Violent overthrow of the government, not just a lone wolf or another street shitting inflatable hot tub tantrum doesn't count? $100. I'll provide the details for an online escrow service.
Are we betting or what? I offered you the bet. Are you actually going to take me up on the offer or were you simply talking out your ass? I've got $10 that says it was the latter.
Property managers are just wage workers.
Read "Against the logic of the guillotine" perhaps