I can't answer what Bombadil is in the lore of LOTR, he seems to be unique in terms of entities we are shown. But I can tell you what he is at a meta level. You see, LOTR was first told as stories to Tolkiens kids, which you probably already knew, which you may not have known, is that Bombadil was a recurring character in previous stories he had told his children. So at a meta level, Bombadil is just a fun callback to a previous character for his kids to have enjoyed.
Asklemmy
A loosely moderated place to ask open-ended questions
Search asklemmy π
If your post meets the following criteria, it's welcome here!
- Open-ended question
- Not offensive: at this point, we do not have the bandwidth to moderate overtly political discussions. Assume best intent and be excellent to each other.
- Not regarding using or support for Lemmy: context, see the list of support communities and tools for finding communities below
- Not ad nauseam inducing: please make sure it is a question that would be new to most members
- An actual topic of discussion
Looking for support?
Looking for a community?
- Lemmyverse: community search
- sub.rehab: maps old subreddits to fediverse options, marks official as such
- [email protected]: a community for finding communities
~Icon~ ~by~ ~@Double_[email protected]~
So, Hoid of a sort
Thank you for indirectly leading me to discover the book title "The Frugal Wizard's Handbook for Surviving Medieval England". Even if I never work my way to finding out anything further about this corner of literature, that title certainly tickled me.
It's a really fun read. Sanderson gets some hate from literary snobs for his simple writing style but sometimes that's the style of story you need.
Title is great, but I didnβt read that one yet because thereβs no Hoid in there. I want to complete the Cosmere reread first.
Except Hoid has/will have a story of his own.
A Proto-Hoid for children
This comes closest of the answers in this thread, imo. Tom Bombadil was a figurine/puppet Tolkien or his kids owned and he would devise stories around it. He included it in the main narrative as a sort of mental resting point, where both the reader and the hobbits come at peace for a brief moment. It's completely separate from the main narrative and it doesn't cleanly fit in the story. I think of it as Tom Bombadil, Goldberry and their house basically being in another dimension, which is why neither time nor the ring affect them.
If you are interested in it, Tolkien discussed the nature of Tom Bombadil in several letters and there are some decent youtube videos on the subject.
I believe he is considered the spirit of that world, not necessarily a god, but a physical incarnation of the world. It would explain why he holds an insane amount of power and even Sauronβs ring only tickled him. It also makes sense when Gandalf says if Mordor conquers the rest of the world then maybe bombadil would fall because the world would be irreparably harmed
I never thought of him being immune to Sauron as him being powerful. He is just like the the hobbits but to its fullest. Bombadil is perfectly content with his own existence and there is nothing for the ring to tempt him with.
I would argue power of will is also power in its own.
so samwise gamgee IS the most powerful being
So why didn't the eagles take him...
Just kidding! Don't want to open that can of worms.
As far as I know Tom is left as an enigmatic character and never explained. Just a strange encounter to make the world seem larger and more mysterious.
Heβs Q but itβs TLOTR
Do we know for sure that Star Trek and LOTR don't play in the same universe?
In Star Trek Enterprise, thereβs an episode where the crew finds a planet being ravaged by disease. Bizarrely, the planet has two humanoid species: one dominant (intelligent, technologically advanced) and one less dominant (less evolved brains). The captain mentions that in every planet theyβve encountered, only one humanoid species survives the process of evolution.
Well, it turns out that the disease is genetic, it only affects the currently-dominant species, and they will go extinct in a few centuries because of it. The same evolutionary phenomenon that explorers encountered countless times before on other planets was happening right before their eyes.
Middle Earth has like at least 3 humanoid species (Man, Elf, Dwarf), more if you count Hobbits and Orcs. Thatβs totally incompatible with Star Trek lore!
Well when we see the story of LotR, the elves and dwarves are disappearing - maybe it's the Trek rule happening in front of us again! Orcs certainly don't seem to fare well during it either. Hobbit are disappearing too, if they're to be counted as separate to humans at all. It's very much becoming a world of humans when the plot of LotR happens
Heβs a merry fellow, bright blue his jacket is and his boots are yellow.
Hey dol merry dol, ring a ding a dillo
Tom represents the incomplete knowledge of mankind and our pre-modern inability to firmly grasp the natural world we live in (and to some extent our continued struggle).
The fantasy world of Middle-Earth is in most ways supernatural to our own. So how much more incomplete would our understanding and knowledge of it been?
Tolkien was a professor of language and mythology and steeped in the ancient epics of the Anglo-saxons and Norse cultures. His career was putting together what these people knew and how they saw the world, but also what they couldn't understand and how they explained their ignorance.
Others here are hinting at what Tom is, but not why he is. He's a manifestation of ignorance. That's why pinning him down is so tricky. It's like pointing at a shadow with a flashlight.
Very good analogy. Questioning Tom Bombadil's role in Middle Earth is the reason Tolkien included him, in my mind at least. The reader sees him as mysterious, mystical, alien, and seemingly detached from the world around him. And we try to fit him into the rest of the world, but not everything fits into nice little boxes. Some aspects of life will always be unknowable. The same goes for history and myth, which Tom seems to be very related to.
He is a character who is not connected to the main conflict in the story in any way, and is meant to show that the world of middle earth is much larger and more mysterious than what the hobbits/men/elves/orcs are fighting over. His back story was left as a mystery on purpose. The simplest explanation to accept is that youβre just not supposed to know.
There is a whole lot of fan theory and actual letters from Tolkien himself explaining (or rather not explaining) the character.
Some had suggested he was the spirit of "JRR Tolkien" placed into his own book
A merry fellow, of course, he says so right in his song
Old Tom Bombadil is a merry fellow, Bright blue his jacket is, and his boots are yellow. None has ever caught him yet, for Tom, he is the Master: His songs are stronger songs, and his feet are faster.
What is there not to get?
Old Tom Bombadil is a merry fellow, Bright blue his jacket is, and his boots are yellow. None has ever caught him yet, for Tom, he is the master: His songs are the stronger songs, and his feet are faster.
He's just a supremely powerful being (nameless thing, perhaps) who was created at the same time as Arda and who is just content living in a forest singing all day about how hot his wife is instead of caring about anything that happens in the world around him.
The question is, what is his wife, Goldberry? She appears to be a personification of nature, Arda, or just the Old Forest or something.
@[email protected] , A statement please.
Hey Derry doll I'm just a merry fellow! In nature I dwell with the trees and green things. With my Goldberry I wonder the old wood and tend to the Withywindle! Come now little folk sing my songs! Derry werry old Tom is singgginggg now. Down the river and over the hill he wonders! Herry ho merry fellow!
Where did you get the snazzy bright blue jacket and yellow boots?
My blue jacket was woven from lost sheep's wool. Fatty Lumpkin ohh he told the sheep I'd treat them well and I'm exhange I got this coat! My yellow boots I crafted to always remind me off my beautiful Goldberry! Oh hey hoo my Goldberry with hair of Gold she the river womans daughter now my wife!
a nature spirit, yeah?
You got some great answers already here. I'll just say that according to Wizards of the Coast he is a God.
Old primordial nature spirit that is a physical manifestation of the worlds untamed wilderness and magical possibility
"Eldest, that's what I am... Tom remembers the first raindrop and the first acorn... He knew the dark under the stars when it was fearless - before the Dark Lord came from Outside."
the Navajo had a tradition of weaving a single, intentional imperfection into the patterns on their blankets and rugs.. they said it was so that their spirit didn't get trapped inside the weave..
TIL - I thought of this as a Persian tradition. Apparently the idea of a deliberate flaw in a woven work features in both cultures.
I like the theory that he is Eru Iluvatar.
Freelance heating engineer.
Tolkien was just retelling legends, folktales, fairy tales, children's bedtime stories etc. He did piece them together to create extended connected lore, but not everything gets cleanly explained away in this kind of worldbuilding technique.
So really imo Tom Bombadil is just some contrivance of Tolkien to make the story feel more like some old fairy tale.
He's just this guy, you know?
A druidic forest spirit.
Maybe he's a demi-god whose back story we don't know enough about.
Gandalf seems pretty human to start with, but then we find out that he's a superhuman/demigod. That whole circle of wizards seems superhuman.
What was Sauron?
I think CS Lewis and Lewis Carroll had a better approach of just being like "Look, anything we want can show up as part of the story."
Tolkien had to create all of these taxonomies, bloodlines, and typing, which is why we're talking about this.
Ooh I know some of this!
Sauron was a Maia (lesser primordial spirit), who along with Morgoth (a fallen spirit formally known as Melkor) was at odds with essentially every other spirit and the general concepts of peace and tranquility that were sought by the creators of the universe. After Morgoth was defeated, Sauron inherited the role of the eponymous Dark Lord and sought to rule Middle-Earth in its entirety.
The Wizards were the Istar, a group of Maiar tasked by the Valar (greater spirits) and Manwe (the king of the Valar) to travel to Middle-Earth and aid the Free People in their fight against Sauron. They took the form of elderly men and roamed the lands to counter and subvert Saurons influence. Their mandate prevented them from open conflict, which is why they took on the role of advisors and supporters instead of just fighting Sauron head on or rallying armies to fight him. Their origins were unknown to any of the Free People, but the Elves for sure new that they weren't just Men - since they lived for thousands of years and had gifts that no mortal Men possessed.
Bombadil is likely another Valar, off in Middle Earth doing his own thing - in ancient ages many of the Valar visited or lived in Middle Earth, so it could be that he didn't return to Valinor and just hung around. His complete disinterest in intervening in the conflict is one clue, and the fact that he exceeds Sauron in raw power as the One Ring is completely mundane to him, whereas Gandalf fears that it will overpower him, is another.