this post was submitted on 13 May 2024
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A tiny, low-priced electric car called the Seagull has American automakers and politicians trembling.

The car, launched last year by Chinese automaker BYD, sells for around $12,000 in China, but drives well and is put together with craftsmanship that rivals U.S.-made electric vehicles that cost three times as much. A shorter-range version costs under $10,000.

Tariffs on imported Chinese vehicles probably will keep the Seagull away from America’s shores for now, and it likely would sell for more than 12 grand if imported.

But the rapid emergence of low-priced EVs from China could shake up the global auto industry in ways not seen since Japanese makers exploded on the scene during the oil crises of the 1970s. BYD, which stands for “Build Your Dreams,” could be a nightmare for the U.S. auto industry.

“Any car company that’s not paying attention to them as a competitor is going to be lost when they hit their market,” said Sam Fiorani, a vice president at AutoForecast Solutions near Philadelphia. “BYD’s entry into the U.S. market isn’t an if. It’s a when.”

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[–] [email protected] 88 points 3 months ago (10 children)

A tiny, low-priced electric car called the Seagull has American automakers and politicians trembling.

Hyperbole as rhetorical device is getting exhausting and makes me extremely skeptical.

[–] [email protected] 17 points 3 months ago* (last edited 3 months ago) (1 children)

This whole article is just paid marketing. Some AP journalist didn't tear this car down and analyze its build quality.

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[–] [email protected] 72 points 3 months ago (1 children)

a threat to US auto industry? You promise? Cus US auto industry is a climate killing powerhouse of gas guzzling SUV's. Any politicians wanting to pretend to be capitalist, or to be in favor of the environment, let me buy this car.

[–] [email protected] 17 points 3 months ago (4 children)

No one i know under 50 years old wants a giant truck or suv, and thats all they wanna sell us. My only friends with new car $ bought a small wagon, which is all I'd want myself.

Those huge electric pickups are too heavy for our guardrails on top of everything else; it's insane and dangerous to let the big three make car culture here even worse.

[–] [email protected] 11 points 3 months ago (2 children)

I know so many boomers with fucking monster vehicles. Even my car nut friends daily drive sedans and small EV's. We're not idiots or rich.

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[–] [email protected] 10 points 3 months ago

No one i know under 50 years old wants a giant truck or suv

Where could we even park them if we did? My garage barely fits the two sedans my wife and I need to get to work on opposite sides of town, in a city with functionally no mass transit.

I might not mind owning a single SUV if I used it exclusively for long trips and as a make-shift camping van. But I simply do not have the acreage in my postage-stamp lot size of a three-story walk-up to host more than that. Not that some of my neighbors don't try, clogging all the sidewalks and curb spaces with their monster trucks.

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[–] [email protected] 58 points 3 months ago (1 children)

The bigger issue is the U.S. auto dealership industry.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/climate-solutions/2023/11/09/car-dealerships-ev-sales/

If dealerships refuse to sell EVs, what can be done? Especially in states where cars can only be sold from licensed dealerships?

[–] [email protected] 9 points 3 months ago* (last edited 3 months ago) (2 children)

If dealerships refuse to sell EVs, what can be done?

Direct sales, which is becoming increasingly popular in a car market where dealership market ups price people out of purchases.

Especially in states where cars can only be sold from licensed dealerships?

We'll see how long that lasts. Dealerships are the last great American petty aristocracy in a business environment that's increasingly all about absolute monarchies. Tesla has already been lobbying hard to overturn the ban on direct sales in Texas, and is doing plenty to end-run the system in the meanwhile. Amazon would love to get into the automotive market (we'll see where they go with their Rivian partnership). Silicon Valley hates these guys for getting in the way of their own drop shipping schemes. And its just a matter of time before the dam bursts.

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[–] [email protected] 48 points 3 months ago (8 children)

I don't see a problem here. If the US auto makers are so worried, they should buy a few of them, copy their secrets, and sell them at a marked down price.
Turnabout is fair play, after all.

[–] [email protected] 70 points 3 months ago (12 children)

They'd prefer to sell you a giant SUV or truck with massive profit margins and so they can continue to flout emissions standards.

[–] [email protected] 29 points 3 months ago (3 children)

Don't forget our big three are just chomping at the bit to get in on the subscription model. Oh, you want 'good' brakes, well that's $19.99/month. And there's no 'secrets' to the chinese cars, I am willing to bet that they are just selling them at a loss. It's not like they have to report real earnings to anyone.

[–] [email protected] 18 points 3 months ago

They are just trying to kill the entire car industry. Which, at this point I could give a shit about. Car manufacturer seem to think that a car should be an investment… Except it depreciates.

Personally I’m not sure I would want that car as my only vehicle because I only have space for one car, but if I get a bigger place with a two car garage I would definitely be interested in a small electric car that doesn’t break my budget. I would probably use it 1/5 trips.

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[–] [email protected] 47 points 3 months ago (1 children)

Leverage your precious free market capitalism and compete, assholes. It's not a threat, it's an opportunity.

[–] [email protected] 26 points 3 months ago

So, there's a guy Silicon Valley Billionaire named Peter Thiel who released a book back in 2014 called "Zero to One", in which he advocates for the monopoly system and claims any good businessman ultimately seeks to corner the market.

The US car market has been consolidating over the last 40 years, in an effort to cartelize and ultimately monopolize the automotive industry. We've passed a host of regulations and taxes that compel foreign manufacturers to build and assemble cars domestically, to partner with US car firms, and to absorb parts of the market American firms don't want to occupy (US firms have functionally given up making small cars - almost everything is a truck or an SUV now). And we've unleashed our investment banks on East Asian industries, guaranteeing financial control of the largest firms in Korea, Japan, The Phillipines, and Taiwan via our international system of credits and debits.

The goal was never free markets, it was captured revenue streams. As we enter a new high surveillance age, vehicles are increasingly part of the always-on Internet Of Things information network used to continuously monitor anyone with enough money to afford a cellular device.

Excising firms like Huawei, ByteDance, and now BYD from the US marketplace is about cementing that captured state of the American economy and tightening the surveillance network. These are absolutely perceived of as threats, because they don't integrate into our controlled networks. Until Chinese businesses are willing to submit to Five-Eyes surveillance and the Chicago School Economics of the New York banks, they're not welcome in our country.

[–] [email protected] 34 points 3 months ago (25 children)

OK but let's talk about the practical thing, how do I, a random American, get one?

[–] [email protected] 9 points 3 months ago

Drive it over the border from Mexico. Although, you'll likely have to pay above the sticker price. Latin Americans are gobbling up Chinese NEVs as fast as they can deliver them.

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[–] [email protected] 33 points 3 months ago (9 children)

China: offers affordable EV

US Auto: NOoooooooooooooo!!

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[–] [email protected] 30 points 3 months ago (5 children)

Americans forced the world into the capitalist system, and now they don’t like it when China does capitalism. Why are they so afraid of the free market?

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[–] [email protected] 26 points 3 months ago

A electric car that is not a SUV? I am in!!! Here in Canada the only option for EV are Prius and SUV. No small EV car under 20k. I say bring them on!! Otherwise I will continue to buy juices from arabian country.

[–] [email protected] 23 points 3 months ago* (last edited 3 months ago) (1 children)

I don't want a Chinese car but at the same time if American automakers are going to continue refusing to make affordable electric cars and only give massive SUVs and trucks as our gas options then it seems like that's pretty much the choice we'll be left with.

Edit: if this frightens the Biden administration then they need to find a way to put pressure on American manufacturers to make some decent vehicles.

[–] [email protected] 12 points 3 months ago

I'm really not a fan of China, but I'm inclined to agree. We need smaller, more affordable vehicles. SUVs are antiquated, and trucks are largely decorative for most of the population. We need smaller, lighter vehicles. Though we also should be investing much more into mass transit rather than (largely redundant) highways and roads anyways, as it's a huge waste of taxpayer money. Keep the key highways, build rail to reduce reliance on shit we shouldn't really be rebuilding anyways. A lot of highways are going to be hitting the end of their useful lives soon, anyways, and require rebuilds.

[–] [email protected] 21 points 3 months ago (1 children)

The Big Three have already had Biden's ear for a while on this, which is why he's quadrupling tariffs on Chinese EVs this week. Source

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[–] [email protected] 18 points 3 months ago (3 children)

It doesn't. That car will never be here without direct investment in U.S. factories.

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[–] [email protected] 18 points 3 months ago

Just want to remind people that BYD has been in the American market since 2011. They've been involved with building industrial vehicles like trucks and buses.

[–] [email protected] 18 points 3 months ago (17 children)

It's easy to build a cheap car when you ignore the human rights of your workers and the environmental damage of your production process.

[–] [email protected] 37 points 3 months ago

Lol western nations dint give a fuck about that. They just externalized the environmental costs to China and other poor nations until now and then sold the end result to their customers. The only problem is that that US doesn't own the company.

[–] [email protected] 27 points 3 months ago

Ford when they outsourced to South Africa during their apartheid for cheap exploit labor

All 3 American automakers who already outsourced to Mexico right now to do the exact same thing

Yellen telling China to scale back eco tech production to protect American profits

Ah yes America, the global leader in human rights and environmental protection.

[–] [email protected] 15 points 3 months ago (12 children)

Or our businesses don't want this type of competition? An affordable and reliable sub 10k EV? This would hurt our businesses and billionaire class, no?

If I needed a new car, and had a 10k EV as an option, it'd be my first choice to look into.

Por que no los dos, though.

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[–] [email protected] 12 points 3 months ago* (last edited 3 months ago) (1 children)

Wikipedia ~~doesn't have an article in English~~ but does have one in French :
https://fr.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/BYD_Seagull
Speed, max : 130 km/h
Range : 305 km with 30 kWh sodium? bat. pack,
... 405 km with 38 kWh Lithium bat. pack
Lower cost sodium ion (?) battery tech.
https://www.moniteurautomobile.be/actu-auto/nouveaux-modeles/byd-seagull-11000-et-des-batteries-sodium-ion.html
Electric motor : TZ180XSH (permanent magnet synchronous for higher efficiency)
Kerb weight : 1,160–1,240 kg

[–] [email protected] 10 points 3 months ago (1 children)

Yes it does: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BYD_Seagull

Might be a connectivity issue on your end (or the mobile link playing up).

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