this post was submitted on 26 Aug 2023
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Zoom, the videoconferencing platform that profited substantially from remote work during the pandemic, is now asking employees to return to the office. Its CEO, Eric Yuan, claims Zoom meetings don't let people build trust or be innovative.

[...]

Yuan explained that trust is essential "for everything," and he finds it hard to build not only that but also innovation and debates over Zoom.

"Quite often, you come up with great ideas, but when we are all on Zoom, it's really hard," Yuan said, according to Insider. "We cannot have a great conversation. We cannot debate each other well because everyone tends to be very friendly when you join a Zoom call."

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[–] [email protected] 173 points 1 year ago (5 children)

My guess: This guy, and all his rich friends have a ton of money invested in commercial real estate. He's putting his own interest before the interest of his company. The more people work from home the better for Zoom, but the worse off he and his rich friends are.

[–] [email protected] 75 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Or it's a way to lower the head count without doing layoffs. The problem with doing it this way of course is that you'll lose your best employees.

[–] [email protected] 35 points 1 year ago

They don't care. They think once the initial build is complete you only need junior devs to maintain.

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[–] [email protected] 84 points 1 year ago (3 children)

Interesting that Zoom is not making an attempt to build features that increase trust, enable innovation and encourage robust debates in their app. Seems like a missed opportunity.

[–] [email protected] 43 points 1 year ago

Evidently they couldn't figure out how to do it over zoom.

[–] [email protected] 3 points 1 year ago

It's impossible to implement a feature that prevents employees from recording the zoom meetings when the boss is ~~abusive~~ robustly debating their employees.

To avoid headaches with HR, we're going to need you to come into the office so your boss can feel more free to robustly debate you from time to time.

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[–] [email protected] 79 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago)

The amount of "innovation and debate" I've seen during remote meetings is no different than when I used to work in an office. Meetings are either exhausting and dead (when they're the usual bullshit administrative meetings that no one wants to be in and could've been handled via email) or they're fun and engaging (when its something like a working session where the participants want to be there).

This guy is an idiot and, as others in this thread have already stated, he's got ulterior motives beyond "innovation and debate."

[–] [email protected] 71 points 1 year ago (6 children)

I've never seen a CEO this publically against their own business lmao

[–] [email protected] 22 points 1 year ago (4 children)

Him and his buddies must have large investments in commercial real estate. I can't possible think of another reason why he would willingly tank the company. Make as many short-term gains as possible then bail.

[–] [email protected] 24 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Her, personally, cannot handle remote communication methods and is projecting his inability onto everyone else. People that make it to CEO if large companies are used to in person communication without any possible recording of their behavior as they berate coworkers.

He is complaining about everyone being nice on zoom. He wants to not be nice.

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[–] [email protected] 62 points 1 year ago

Seems like the opposite of what they should be saying.

[–] [email protected] 55 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago)

I wish everyone who works at zoom a very fruitful soft quitting.

This is all a method to get people to quit so they don't have to list layoff nor have to pay severance.

Fuck them. Go to the office, but give it your 10% at best. Stall things. Claim lack of motivated leadership if HR makes a stink. Make them fire you and get that bread in the meantime.

[–] [email protected] 53 points 1 year ago (3 children)

everyone tends to be very friendly when you join a zoom call

I'm sorry but are you suggesting hostility leads to innovation? Are you a fucking sociopath?

[–] [email protected] 26 points 1 year ago

Are you a fucking sociopath?

Very likely. Capitalism encourages this type of behavior, to get (and stay) at the top you need to be a greedy, unhinged sociopath.

[–] [email protected] 10 points 1 year ago

No, but I think he means that people hold back opposing ideas because of fear of hurting others. Then there are other group dynamics involved which suppress people expressing them selfies. I would have thought this wold be less of a problem in online meetings

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[–] [email protected] 45 points 1 year ago (1 children)
[–] [email protected] 38 points 1 year ago

Translation: I fucked up and want to beat the employees for my failure

[–] [email protected] 38 points 1 year ago (6 children)

This part is my favorite:

"Quite often, you come up with great ideas, but when we are all on Zoom, it's really hard," Yuan said, according to Insider. "We cannot have a great conversation. We cannot debate each other well because everyone tends to be very friendly when you join a Zoom call."

Sounds like the issue is people wanting to avoid a talking to by HR for being "uncooperative" to me, but what do I know, I'm not the CEO of a company actively portraying the company's product as bad at its sole purpose of existing.

[–] st0v 4 points 1 year ago (1 children)

For me it's like this, I have a useful point to add to the conversation but when I interject the lag is juuuuust long enough that it ends up I'm talking over the next person.

So when I lead a meeting with zoom participants I either force dead air to allow the remote people to jump in, or I eat as much dead air as possible to lock them out of the conversation. depending on my own agenda.

incidentally this problem doesn't exist in asynchronous collaboration methods. but zoom and it's like win out on shear informwtion bandwidth.

The current video conferencing and remote working systems are indeed amazing feats of technology and social acceptance, but we still need to work on it. a lot.

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[–] [email protected] 37 points 1 year ago (1 children)

This guy words his argument as though he's upset his product prevents him from having non-recorded temper tantrums at junior employees.

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[–] [email protected] 32 points 1 year ago

"Quite often, you come up with great ideas, but when we are all on Zoom, it's really hard,"

Easy, close the company down.

[–] [email protected] 27 points 1 year ago (2 children)

Zoom needs to implement whiteboards and people need to be issued digitizing pens/tables so they can draw diagrams freely

[–] [email protected] 11 points 1 year ago (4 children)

Zoom has had a whiteboard since multiple years... But yeah, issuing tablets would make that feature more productive.

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[–] [email protected] 3 points 1 year ago

Yup, they have whiteboards, which is the most kindergarten-level attempt to "increase trust, enable innovation and encourage robust debates". There is so much potential in this space. Check out these demos of Loomio for a glimpse:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fuWfEwlWFlw
https://youtu.be/itXYid8eSiI?si=hsq4RzMFAe_mVlG_&t=212

[–] [email protected] 24 points 1 year ago (2 children)

We cannot debate each other well because everyone tends to be very friendly when you join a Zoom call.

Translation: "I want to be a dick to people face to face, so they can't just turn the camera off and flip a bird towards the screen".

[–] [email protected] 24 points 1 year ago

They can also be recorded, so if you really mess up, there is evidence.

[–] [email protected] 14 points 1 year ago (2 children)

Anyone who says you can’t debate over the Internet has never actually used the internet. Of the 10% that isn’t porn half of it is debates.

[–] [email protected] 8 points 1 year ago (1 children)

I think you spelled "shit slinging contests where both sides already have their minds made up" wrong

[–] [email protected] 4 points 1 year ago

But who's poo smells better?

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[–] [email protected] 17 points 1 year ago

bro has clearly not been in any of my discord chats

[–] [email protected] 16 points 1 year ago

Zoom is dead in the water. They cannot innovate and this will cause them to fall further behind. Workers are more productive remote.

[–] [email protected] 14 points 1 year ago
[–] [email protected] 10 points 1 year ago

Ah, the ancient art of 'Zoomology,' where gazing at colleagues' pixelated foreheads supposedly squashes innovation. Clearly, the key to groundbreaking ideas lies in the fluorescent lights and watercooler chitchat of the office jungle

[–] [email protected] 10 points 1 year ago

So just because he is psychotically social, everyone has to be?

This doesn’t seem to be maximizing shareholders’ investment. I give it three months before he “moves on to the next opportunity.”

[–] [email protected] 8 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (1 children)

Head Accountant: “Sir, our stocks have plummeted to Zero!” Eric:

[–] [email protected] 3 points 1 year ago (1 children)

HD surprised pikachu, whaat?

[–] [email protected] 8 points 1 year ago

The future is now old man

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