this post was submitted on 04 Jul 2023
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At work we somehow landed on the topic of how many holes a human has, which then evolved into a heated discussion on the classic question of how many holes does a straw have.

I think it's two, but some people are convinced that it's one, which I just don't understand. What are your thoughts?

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[–] [email protected] 110 points 2 years ago (23 children)

1 'hole' if you can call it that. Imagine if the straw started life as a solid cylinder and you had to bore out the inside to turn it into a straw: if that were the case, you would drill 1 hole all the way through it.

Another analogy is a donut. Would you agree that a donut has just 1 hole? I would say yes. Now stretch that donut vertically untill you have a giant cylinder with a hole in the middle. That's basically now just a straw. The fact you stretched it doesn't increase the number of holes it has.

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[–] [email protected] 60 points 2 years ago (15 children)

How many holes does a donut have?

Now make the donut higher. A lot higher. Now you have a donut-tunnel. Now make the walls thinner. Now shrink it. Now you have a straw.

One hole.

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[–] [email protected] 54 points 2 years ago (23 children)

How many holes does a rubber band have? A donut?

Topologically a rubber band, a donut, and a straw have the same number of holes. The hole at either end of the straw is just a continuation of the same one hole.

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[–] [email protected] 51 points 2 years ago (6 children)

Classic topology question. Absolutely one hole; it goes all the way through.

Of course, connotatively, two is a fine assessment, but not in topology.

How many holes does a donut have? Now just try to image the real difference between a straw and a donut. Is there one, aside from deliciousness?

[–] [email protected] 10 points 2 years ago (1 children)

Deliciousness here is only limited by bravery.

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[–] [email protected] 50 points 2 years ago* (last edited 2 years ago) (4 children)

Mathematically It's one. Think of a disk, like a CD, does it have one hole or two? One, right? Now imagine you can make it thicker, I.e. increase the height, and then reduce the outer radius... Making it progressively more straw-like. At what point does it stop having 1 hole and begin to have 2?

Topologically they're the same shape.

I'm sure Matt Parker has a video on this topic in YouTube. Here

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[–] [email protected] 41 points 2 years ago (7 children)

how many holes does a donut have? one. a straw is just a tall plastic donut.

two holes... smdh... kids these days

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[–] [email protected] 35 points 2 years ago (8 children)

A straw is geometrically the same as a circular piece of paper with a z depth of zero and a hole in the middle. Because the z depth is zero there is only one hole. As you add thickness the one hole remains. Therefore, a straw has one hole.

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[–] [email protected] 30 points 2 years ago (3 children)

Does a doughnut have two holes?

Because a straw is just an elongated doughnut.

[–] [email protected] 11 points 2 years ago (3 children)
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[–] [email protected] 29 points 2 years ago (5 children)

It has two exits, one hole.

If you drill a hole in a block of wood you create one hole not two, note that whether or not the drill exits the opposite side, only one hole has been created despite differing numbers of exits.

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[–] [email protected] 29 points 2 years ago (1 children)
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[–] [email protected] 25 points 2 years ago (8 children)

The answer depends on the context. Topologically, it's one. I personally like zero. If I say "There's a hole in my straw!" You'll not think all straws have holes. You'll think there's something wrong with it.

[–] [email protected] 15 points 2 years ago

To be fair, I think shirts already have holes, but if I said "there's a hole in my shirt" you'd think there was an EXTRA hole

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[–] [email protected] 22 points 2 years ago* (last edited 2 years ago) (1 children)

It's one, big long hole. If you drilled a hole through a board, do you say it's two holes?

Or it's 0 holes, as it's not cut out of something, but rather just formed that way meaning by strict dictionary definition, there are no "holes."

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[–] [email protected] 20 points 2 years ago (1 children)

I believe the confusion lies in the word "holes" when you are thinking about openings or exits. Just my 2 cents.

[–] [email protected] 7 points 2 years ago (1 children)

Yes, I agree. "Hole" is poorly defined. This isn't a technical question about straws but a technical question about language.

[–] [email protected] 8 points 2 years ago (1 children)

That's the gist of practically all philosophical thought experiments.

When is a heap of sand no longer a heap? I dunno, define "heap" and there's your answer. It's not going to be a useful answer though because the rest of the world doesn't define the word with enough precision for the question to be meaningful in the first place. There is no authority on Earth that can do that. You can define the problem in precise mathematical terms but then it will NOT be the same thing as a plain-English "heap" and you'd be pulling a fast one if you acted like it was.

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[–] [email protected] 17 points 2 years ago

One of course, what a weird conversation to have.

[–] [email protected] 15 points 2 years ago* (last edited 2 years ago) (1 children)

To settle this argument could you clarify if we're supposed to be considering the straw as a solid 3D object with a thickness, or as a curved 2D surface? The answer kind of depends on which you pick.

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[–] [email protected] 14 points 2 years ago (1 children)

one hole is going through the straw

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[–] [email protected] 14 points 2 years ago (1 children)

If you make the straw less long, it’s a donut. And a donut obviously has 1 hole. So a long donut only has one hole. Q.E.D

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[–] [email protected] 14 points 2 years ago (2 children)

A hollow cylinder has a single hole, with two openings. A hole can be open on one end only (e.g., a well is a hole in the ground), or it can have multiple openings (e.g., a straw has a hole with two openings).

If one cannot immediately tell whether two openings are connected to one another, then one assumes they are not; e.g., if you see a well in Florida you don't assume it is the opening of a hole that extends to connect to another opening in Australia.

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[–] [email protected] 13 points 2 years ago (1 children)

I’m more interested in humans. Is the mouth and anus two holes or one?

[–] [email protected] 16 points 2 years ago
[–] [email protected] 11 points 2 years ago* (last edited 2 years ago) (3 children)

Well, depends what you call a hole. Does a glass have a hole? Does a bottle have a hole?

If you said no to both, you mean a topological hole and a straw has one.

If you said yes to one or both of them, you mean a tight opening in which someting can be inserted (yes yes, innuendo). How tight an opening must be to be a hole is arbitrary and subjective, it depends on the person. In this case a straw has two holes.

[–] [email protected] 7 points 2 years ago (1 children)

Continuing on the innuendo: topologically a vagina is not a hole, but a butthole is.

You could argue that a hole is an entrance to a wider space. A door or window is a hole to a room. If you want to know the number of holes in a room, you would at least have to include all the doors and windows.

In this sense, the straw doesn't have a hole at all.

Or maybe it is just one hole.

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[–] [email protected] 11 points 2 years ago

Poop. Beans. Here come the holes.

[–] [email protected] 10 points 2 years ago (2 children)
  1. A straw is a continuous surface without any holes.
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[–] [email protected] 9 points 2 years ago (2 children)

How far are you zooming in? I'd say there are basically infinite holes if you look at it at an atomic scale

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[–] [email protected] 8 points 2 years ago
[–] [email protected] 7 points 2 years ago

One common definition of a hole defines a hole specifically as the opening. If the definition applies only to the opening, this implies that the hole exists on a 2-dimensional plane. Despite the fact that the openings are connected along a tunnel, we don't care about the structure of a hole beyond the 'opening', we can ignore everything else. If we continue on that path, there are 2 visible holes on a straw.

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