this post was submitted on 06 Nov 2024
867 points (97.2% liked)

News

23301 readers
3347 users here now

Welcome to the News community!

Rules:

1. Be civil


Attack the argument, not the person. No racism/sexism/bigotry. Good faith argumentation only. This includes accusing another user of being a bot or paid actor. Trolling is uncivil and is grounds for removal and/or a community ban. Do not respond to rule-breaking content; report it and move on.


2. All posts should contain a source (url) that is as reliable and unbiased as possible and must only contain one link.


Obvious right or left wing sources will be removed at the mods discretion. We have an actively updated blocklist, which you can see here: https://lemmy.world/post/2246130 if you feel like any website is missing, contact the mods. Supporting links can be added in comments or posted seperately but not to the post body.


3. No bots, spam or self-promotion.


Only approved bots, which follow the guidelines for bots set by the instance, are allowed.


4. Post titles should be the same as the article used as source.


Posts which titles don’t match the source won’t be removed, but the autoMod will notify you, and if your title misrepresents the original article, the post will be deleted. If the site changed their headline, the bot might still contact you, just ignore it, we won’t delete your post.


5. Only recent news is allowed.


Posts must be news from the most recent 30 days.


6. All posts must be news articles.


No opinion pieces, Listicles, editorials or celebrity gossip is allowed. All posts will be judged on a case-by-case basis.


7. No duplicate posts.


If a source you used was already posted by someone else, the autoMod will leave a message. Please remove your post if the autoMod is correct. If the post that matches your post is very old, we refer you to rule 5.


8. Misinformation is prohibited.


Misinformation / propaganda is strictly prohibited. Any comment or post containing or linking to misinformation will be removed. If you feel that your post has been removed in error, credible sources must be provided.


9. No link shorteners.


The auto mod will contact you if a link shortener is detected, please delete your post if they are right.


10. Don't copy entire article in your post body


For copyright reasons, you are not allowed to copy an entire article into your post body. This is an instance wide rule, that is strictly enforced in this community.

founded 1 year ago
MODERATORS
top 50 comments
sorted by: hot top controversial new old
[–] [email protected] 239 points 1 week ago (2 children)

Judging by the latest election, the number seams a lot higher, more like three in five

[–] [email protected] 77 points 1 week ago (1 children)

One in five do not think Hitler was all bad. Two in five think he was better than a lady who laughs sometimes.

[–] [email protected] 39 points 1 week ago

And the idiots that didn't bother to vote, accepted this outcome

[–] [email protected] 29 points 1 week ago

My thoughts exactly. Wait though, actually that is the fault of Democrats, somehow. I'll get back to you on how

[–] [email protected] 90 points 1 week ago (2 children)

Fools never see evil until its at their door.

[–] [email protected] 25 points 1 week ago

They see the evil but think it will be to their advantage because they aren't like "those people."

load more comments (1 replies)
[–] [email protected] 71 points 1 week ago (1 children)

Hitler was nothing without the NSDAP and the fascist movement.

There were 915,000 Germans in the Waffen-SS.


In case you don't remember, what we're talking about here:

load more comments (1 replies)
[–] [email protected] 67 points 1 week ago (1 children)

It's like watching a horror movie. You know the killer is in the basement, yet people go and have a look while the audience knows what's going to happen. A classic fuck around and find out.

[–] [email protected] 8 points 1 week ago (1 children)

Well we now know there are truly people stupid enough to do so.

load more comments (1 replies)
[–] [email protected] 57 points 1 week ago (4 children)

This is how hitler came to power.

load more comments (4 replies)
[–] [email protected] 52 points 1 week ago (2 children)

That's not fair phrasing and will lead to high numbers.

Hitler wasn't "all" bad technically, he was just so bad that the good shouldn't matter at all. Pushing forward technology (VW Beetle, Autobahn) should is no way be justified by genocide (obviously).

A better question would have been something like "do you like Hitler overall?"

[–] [email protected] 34 points 1 week ago* (last edited 1 week ago) (4 children)

The full poll data: https://d3nkl3psvxxpe9.cloudfront.net/documents/Views_on_Hitler_poll_results.pdf

Do you think of Adolf Hitler as. . . ?

  • A completely good person: 1%
  • A good person who did some bad things: 4%
  • An equally good and bad person: 7%
  • A bad person who did some good things: 12%
  • A completely bad person : 65%
  • Not sure : 12%

So 12% felt he was at least as good as he was bad, 12% fell into the 'well, even a horrible person can do something right, and 12% were somehow not sure...

[–] [email protected] 8 points 1 week ago (2 children)

This is interesting, thank you for sharing.

I personally would tally this up as "12%" rather than "24%".

Or at least in my opinion, option "D" (bad person that did some good things) is most likely the closest to an objective answer and "E" (completely bad) is a totally acceptable summary. But both D and E both summarize Hitler as bad. The people summarizing him as "balanced" or "good" totaled to 12%.

To be clear, this is still horrific imo.

load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (3 replies)
[–] [email protected] 7 points 1 week ago

Yes a question about Hitler being good overall is far better. Attempting to shove him into an all bad category is just dishonest and allows opponents a free win. The good absolutely should matter, because painting people as all one thing isn't accurate and makes understanding how things happen more difficult.

[–] [email protected] 48 points 1 week ago (10 children)

What a terrible question. He was an awful person but obviously nobody is all bad.

[–] [email protected] 67 points 1 week ago (6 children)

He only has one redeeming quality: killing Hitler.

[–] [email protected] 41 points 1 week ago

but also he killed the guy who killed hitler

load more comments (5 replies)
[–] [email protected] 18 points 1 week ago (1 children)

There is literally nothing I can think of that would make him good in any isolated field. For a long time people held the believe that he was pro environment and animal rights. But he also killed his own dog. People also say that he had a special aura around him. That he was very charming. But those people were likely like trump supporters today. My great grandmother actually got to see him before she fled Germany. She said that there was nothing particularly interesting about him except for the way he speaks maybe.

[–] [email protected] 11 points 1 week ago (1 children)

The question is still to vague. Obviously all of his politics were the worst. But the way it's phrased, you'd kinda have to agree he wasn't ALL bad if, for example, he made a pretty tasty pasta sauce. Like. Not that it'd be relevant. It's the vagueness of the question that I'm critiquing. Maybe I'm just having an autism moment.

load more comments (1 replies)
[–] [email protected] 8 points 1 week ago (3 children)

Depends on how pedantic one wants to be.

load more comments (3 replies)
[–] [email protected] 8 points 1 week ago

The more nuanced data: https://d3nkl3psvxxpe9.cloudfront.net/documents/Views_on_Hitler_poll_results.pdf

I was hoping that the 'not all bad' would be almost all of it. Unfortunately while it was half of it, a full half said Hitler was as good a guy as he was a bad guy, with an equal number responding unsure, which is likely leaning toward I don't want to give a socially unacceptable answer.

load more comments (6 replies)
[–] [email protected] 39 points 1 week ago (1 children)

I sometimes fear that
people think that fascism arrives in fancy dress
worn by grotesques and monsters
as played out in endless re-runs of the Nazis.

Fascism arrives as your friend.
It will restore your honour,
make you feel proud,
protect your house,
give you a job,
clean up the neighbourhood,
remind you of how great you once were,
clear out the venal and the corrupt,
remove anything you feel is unlike you...

It doesn't walk in saying,
"Our programme means militias, mass imprisonments, transportations, war and persecution."

--Michael Rosen.

[–] [email protected] 24 points 1 week ago (2 children)

It doesn’t walk in saying, “Our programme means militias, mass imprisonments, transportations, war and persecution.”

Yeah but evidently it does, and people still choose it.

[–] [email protected] 11 points 1 week ago

American fascism certainly does say those things, but it's always other peoples' faces the leopards will be eating.

load more comments (1 replies)
[–] [email protected] 32 points 1 week ago* (last edited 1 week ago)

Ok, I get it, but we really should avoid looking at things/people like Adolfy as black or white - that just makes it a meme & loses actual historical/lecture value.

With Hitler being a one-dimensional idea/meme/brand instead of a human (supported by humans with rational human causes) I'm afraid we are doomed to repeat the same cycle of mistakes.

What I'm saying is that instead of education we have strong propaganda (after a specific date) that taught us this Hitler brand was just & only bad, like it was a spontaneous event. Instead of a full person & a nation (again full of actual people) with voting rights in irl situations.
And propaganda isn't free, it's financially fueled, which means it wants something in return.

Monsters are humans. We need to remember that, despite what we are preached.

[–] [email protected] 29 points 1 week ago (1 children)

We've got to stop talking about "if" and "when."

It's NOW. This is happening. We are watching the rise of the next Hitler, now, live, today. This isn't hypothetical anymore - yesterday just gave them carte blanche to go full stormtroopers.

At this point, all of our conversations need to be about how we stay safe in the wake.

load more comments (1 replies)
[–] [email protected] 25 points 1 week ago

We know, they just voted for him.

[–] [email protected] 24 points 1 week ago (4 children)

More than one in five apparently.

load more comments (4 replies)
[–] [email protected] 23 points 1 week ago

Definitely a lot more than that based on this election.

[–] [email protected] 21 points 1 week ago (6 children)

well, one thing i'll say in his favour: he did kill hitler.

(credit: jimmy carr)

load more comments (6 replies)
[–] [email protected] 19 points 1 week ago

Kind of a loaded question to include the word "all" but I understand the lack of faith or respect for the USA right about now.

[–] [email protected] 18 points 1 week ago

Well now he's going to be president.

[–] [email protected] 17 points 1 week ago (5 children)

Related: we've all heard the stories of a time traveler going back to kill Hitler before his rise to power. One common theme in almost all those stories is that the attempt fails, that's why history is as we remember. This morning has me thinking that maybe time travel was involved in a couple of Trump assassination attempts.

load more comments (5 replies)
[–] [email protected] 15 points 1 week ago (3 children)

He wasn't "all bad", he apparently was very good with animals, like his dog Blondie. He was a vegetarian. And that's probably everything which wasn't bad. For the rest it's all completely fucked up bad. No doubt about it.

Oh and I just remembered he was very good at giving directions. "were do I need to go?" "Take the third reich"

load more comments (3 replies)
[–] [email protected] 14 points 1 week ago

Apparently Hitler had a dog. So maybe reexamine your beliefs if you think dogs are good judges of character lol.

[–] [email protected] 12 points 1 week ago

I mean he did kill Hitler, that's got to count for something.

[–] [email protected] 12 points 1 week ago

Obviously, Hitler even gave credit to Jim Crow policies as being an inspiration for his generic policies.

The dixiecrats aren't ashamed of that, game recognizes game.

[–] [email protected] 10 points 1 week ago (7 children)

I'm completely against his policies and actions for obvious reasons. I hate Nazis.

Still, I could probably be convinced to say that he wasn't 100% bad in every possible way.

Even the most evil people are complex human beings. There may be something good inside them at some point to some person, etc.

"All" is a very powerful word.

[–] [email protected] 10 points 1 week ago (2 children)

While I agree with the sentiment, I don't think 1 in 5 thought : "well, he's kind with his dog and an OK painter, I can't in good faith say he's completely bad"

load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (6 replies)
[–] [email protected] 9 points 1 week ago (5 children)

23 percent of respondents said Hitler was a "good person or an equally good and bad person" or "a bad person who did some good things," data from YouGov showed.

What a bullshit poll. So basically anyone who recognizes he cared for a dog is seen as liking Hitler.

Anyone who said otherwise doesn't understand spectrums and is generally using black and white thinking, a sign of mental illness

load more comments (5 replies)
[–] [email protected] 8 points 1 week ago

He did promise the masses a family land and a job. The same thing that every politician ever has promised.

[–] [email protected] 8 points 1 week ago

After last night, you don't have to prove we're dumb bastards to me.

[–] [email protected] 7 points 1 week ago

It has just happened. The liberty aura surrounding America has been broken.

[–] [email protected] 7 points 1 week ago

This is what happens when you start to dismantle the education system. We can thank Reagan and the Bushes for that.

[–] [email protected] 7 points 1 week ago

I’m pretty sure we know now that that number is a lot more than we originally thought.

[–] [email protected] 6 points 1 week ago

Sure, Hitler passed some of the first anti-smoking laws.

That doesn’t excuse all the other awful awful things he did.

Also his anti smoking laws failed as the war went on longer and longer.

[–] [email protected] 6 points 1 week ago (1 children)

U.S. opinion on the Nazi dictator remains more negative that it was at the height of World War II, when 25 percent of Americans said his ideas were correct

That's pretty surprising, you'd think when they were fighting him they'd hate him most

load more comments (1 replies)
load more comments
view more: next ›