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As War Drags On, Gazans More Willing to Speak Out Against Hamas (www.nytimes.com)

submitted 2 months ago by [email protected] to c/[email protected]

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[–] [email protected] 9 points 2 months ago (1 children)

Both Hamas and Fatah are corrupt. However, it is impossible to have a free and fair democratic election under an Apartheid State. The Apartheid must end first before it is possible for Palestinians to have a free and fair election.

Hamas does torture and kill political rivals, and has been exposed for corruption. Fatah is also corrupt, seen as working at the behest of Israel at the expense of Palestinians in East Jerusalem and the West Bank.

Both have been funded by Israel as part of a Divide and Conquer tactic. Israel also has a long history of assassinating more moderate and leftist political Palestinian rivals.

Hamas Victory Driven By Desire To End Corruption WPO

Hamas Political Violence in Gaza - HRW 2009

Gaza: Palestinians tortured, summarily killed by Hamas forces during 2014 conflict - Amnesty

Gaza: Journalist facing prison term for exposing corruption in Hamas-controlled ministry - Amnesty

Palestinians furious and fed up with corruption of Abbas's 'mafia' PA - MEE

“Divide and Rule”: How Israel Helped Start Hamas to Weaken Palestinian Hopes for Statehood - DemocracyNow

Rise and Kill First: The Secret History of Israel’s Targeted Assassinations – review - The Guardian

[+] [email protected] -9 points 2 months ago (5 children)

The fucking gall to blame Israel for Hamas torturing and murdering Palestinians.

[–] [email protected] 6 points 2 months ago

Israel is to blame for the Apartheid, yes. Israel has also never stopped torturing or murdering Palestinians themselves, not that you care.

Hamas is obviously responsible for their own crimes against humanity, which have been reported by human rights organizations.

This is an analysis of the corruption within Hamas and Fatah. The existence of both are directly due to the violent Settler Colonialism and Apartheid. On top of that, Israel has funded both as a divide and conquer strategy.

If you don't like either, which is reasonable as neither do the majority of Palestinians, you need to support an end to the Apartheid in order for Palestinians to have a free and fair election. This isn't a difficult concept.

[–] [email protected] 2 points 2 months ago* (last edited 2 months ago) (1 children)

israel gets some of the blame for funding hamas and building them up when they needed them to take out the plo

hamas gets some of the blame for using terrorism as a weapon and attacking israeli citizens while neglecting gazans

[–] [email protected] 3 points 2 months ago (1 children)

Source on Israel funding Hamas?

My understanding is they allowed money to pass from Qatar to Hamas, but never directly funded them.

[–] [email protected] 3 points 2 months ago* (last edited 2 months ago) (1 children)

‘Buying quiet’: Inside the Israeli plan that propped up Hamas - Irish Times

For years, the Qatari government had been sending millions of dollars a month into the Gaza Strip – money that helped prop up the Hamas government there. Israeli prime minister Binyamin Netanyahu had not only tolerated those payments, he had encouraged them.

Allowing the payments – billions of dollars over roughly a decade – was a gamble by Netanyahu that a steady flow of money would maintain peace in Gaza, the eventual launching point of the October 7th attacks, and keep Hamas focused on governing, not fighting.

As far back as December 2012, Netanyahu told prominent Israeli journalist Dan Margalit that it was important to keep Hamas strong, as a counterweight to the Palestinian Authority in the West Bank. Margalit, in an interview, said Netanyahu told him that having two strong rivals, including Hamas, would lessen pressure on him to negotiate toward a Palestinian state.

“The conception of Netanyahu over a decade and a half was that if we buy quiet and pretend the problem isn’t there, we can wait it out and it will fade away,” said Eyal Hulata, Israel’s national security adviser from July 2021 until the beginning of this year.

Qatar’s work in Gaza during this period was blessed by the Israeli government. And Netanyahu even lobbied Washington on Qatar’s behalf. In 2017, as Republicans pushed to impose financial sanctions on Qatar over its support for Hamas, he dispatched senior intelligence officials to Washington. The Israelis told US lawmakers that Qatar had played a positive role in the Gaza Strip, according to three people familiar with the trip.

Israel’s goal was “to ensure that the next confrontation between Israel and Hamas will be the final showdown”, he wrote in the memo, dated December 21st, 2016. A pre-emptive strike, he said, could remove most of the “leadership of the military wing of Hamas”.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 2 months ago (2 children)

So basically it’s what I said? Israel did not give money to Hamas, but did allow money to flow from the Qatari government to them.

The result may have been the same, but I think it’s fair to say Israel didn’t fund Hamas right?

[–] [email protected] 0 points 2 months ago

Israel props them up

[–] [email protected] -1 points 2 months ago (1 children)

Can we blame them for torturing Palestinians when they do it themselves?

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-67581915

How about all those Palestinian children they murdered?

[–] [email protected] 1 points 2 months ago (1 children)

Why the fuck is a mod so active in the comments trying to enter into arguments with people?

[–] [email protected] 0 points 2 months ago* (last edited 2 months ago)

He's just making sure nobody is trash talking Hamas.