this post was submitted on 10 Jul 2024
89 points (100.0% liked)
askchapo
22652 readers
326 users here now
Ask Hexbear is the place to ask and answer ~~thought-provoking~~ questions.
Rules:
-
Posts must ask a question.
-
If the question asked is serious, answer seriously.
-
Questions where you want to learn more about socialism are allowed, but questions in bad faith are not.
-
Try [email protected] if you're having questions about regarding moderation, site policy, the site itself, development, volunteering or the mod team.
founded 4 years ago
MODERATORS
you are viewing a single comment's thread
view the rest of the comments
view the rest of the comments
Project 2025 is more than just the "Mandate for Leadership" playbook. It's also a comprehensive, searchable personnel database of all the most extreme right-wing fascist ghouls who are totally on board with all the stuff in Mandate for Leadership who they will cram into the judiciary at all levels, every agency they don't destroy, and all other appointed gov't positions. It took a lot of work and required people to build and maintain it. It didn't happen in 2017 because it didn't exist yet.
Trump doesn't have to be the one to implement it. It could be any Republican politician. Once it is implemented, executive power will be expanded massively, the courts will be fully captured, all important gov't agencies will be under direct executive branch control, etc, etc. Full fascist state in 180 days.
This part is odd to mention since every single president has expanded the power of the presidency
bad news, we're already a full fascist state
as bad as the US is, we are far from as bad as we could ever get, and project 2025 is a clearly stated intention to take one of the single biggest steps towards "as bad as we could ever get" in US history
https://hexbear.net/post/2961436?scrollToComments=false
Project 2025 is ultimately bipartisan and the Dems will happily do it themselves.
okay but dems passing one single measure of two provisions of project 2025 is different from making the entire package of project 2025 your party line
That's just a single example. Have you noticed that Biden campaigned against Trump's horrific border and immigration policies, and now is doing the exact same shit but worse? Same thing with the trade war against China. The democrats are constantly demonstrating to anybody willing to open their eyes that they are the exact same as the republicans except for their rhetoric. That's the only difference. Biden would do project 2025 bipartisanly and talk about how important it is to reach across the aisle.
Biden is also doing absolutely nothing to prevent project 2025, despite having just been handed a license to do literally anything as long as it's "official". Project 2025 is just the newest cudgel for the dems to beat down any dissent and drive people to the polls to vote for them. If they actually cared to stop it they would be doing it today.
its so. fucking. annoying when I talk about american politics in a discussion about american politics and I make literally any value judgment of a difference between the democratic party and the republican party and people come along to patronizingly tell me "Ackshually, both sides are bad and do bad things! You should get educated." bestie if we're opening discussion up like that then my real vote is for Stalin to come alive and beat Sleepy Joe to death with a bat televised over the national alert system and assume leadership but we're not because we have to limit ourselves to the scope of what is plausible. All that is relevant in US executive politics is the Democrats and the Republicans. Biden is not firing 95% of federal employees. Biden is not criminalizing being transgender in public. Biden is not governing by executive order. The 2025 ghouls have said that they will. They're both shit sandwiches and they both have cyanide in them but the shit sandwiches are materially different from each other. the party in charge has implications in trans rights, foreign policy, medical care, disability rights, and economics - even if it's not always even in favor of the dems, which it is often not. I'll genuflect to the supreme Hitlerian nature of Biden if that's the toll I have to pay to talk about US party politics but please let's not pretend that Republicans and Democrats are identical.
Either the administration doesn't believe the shit they're saying about the EnD oF dEmOcRaCy, or they're perfectly fine with whatever they say Trump will do. There is no other explanation for their total lack of tangible action to prevent Trump from winning.
"I'll feel as long as I gave it my all and I did the goodest job as I know I can do, that's what this is about."
These are not the words of someone who fears the end of democracy in America.
And just to say, if you vote for Biden there is no way to silo off your vote from genocide. If you vote for Biden, you vote for genocide.
I can really say "my real vote is for Stalin to come alive and beat Sleepy Joe to death with a bat televised over the national alert system and assume leadership" and still have people suspect me of being a biden voter. I'm voting for whatever socialist is on the ballot where I live. but question, if voting doesn't matter, which it kinda doesn't, what's with the intense Biden vote shaming? I think I know the answer but I'm curious to hear from someone who does it
Yeah, but like expanded all the way. Full executive control of all agencies (including FBI and CIA and state department) and also (essentially) the judiciary.
Not as fascist as it could be.
Dang it's a shame there isn't someone in the white house who might be able to do something preventative to stop this boogeyman
Yep. He could send SCOTUS and Trump to Gitmo or seal team 6 them. Some might call that shortsighted, but he could do it - the fallout and precedent would just be... complicated
Either the administration does not believe their own rhetoric about the end of democracy, or they're perfectly fine with allowing it to happen. Those are the only two explanations for all this bleating about project 2025 with absolutely zero action to prevent it.
Well, there is some (very liberal) action being taken to prevent it. Basically, there is a large congressional task force trying to figure out how to prevent Project 2025 from being implemented and also another focused on trying to prevent/challenge the sweeping presidential immunity granted by the supreme court 2 weeks ago. They've proposed a constitutional amendment to specifically state that the president does not have criminal immunity and have plans to prevent actions being taken/generally be obstructionist.
Now, the obvious problems are 1) you have to keep "stopping project 2025" every 4 years, and as soon as a Republican gets into office - boom, it's done. 2) constitutional amendments require 2/3 majority votes in the House and Senate to pass - and Dems will never have a 2/3 majority, and the vote will be on party lines. 3) as soon as it is implemented, the changes will all be made legal - the fascists will shape the gov't around them as soon as they gain power, that's the whole point of what project 2025 is.
I don't think there's any expansion of power left. The POTUS can legally kill anyone he wants now for any reason.
the courts are already fully captured.
They already are. That's what the executive is.
We're already there, it's just that no one has really flexed it in ways that most people can see or care about.
The supreme court just gave a democratic president the power to do whatever the fuck he wants. This demonstrates that the supporters of project 2025 consider democrats to be their allies rather than their enemies. The democrats have used this newfound power to continue to do absolutely nothing to stop their supposed enemies.
If you want to stop project 2025, supporting democrats has proven to be the wrong approach
They have, and they haven't. Intentionally. Basically, they defined what counts as Official acts but not Unofficial acts. POTUS only has immunity for official acts.
So, say Biden drone strikes Trump and claims immunity for protecting the constitution or whatever. He immediately gets taken to court for murder, sedition, etc. The DC district court finds "yep he's immune alright". The ruling will get brought before the Supreme Court at which point they'll say "oh actually, the president is immune from everything except drone striking political rivals - obviously the FoUnDiNg fAtHeRs wanted the president to be able to do anything EXCEPT drone strike white people. Biden, you're guilty of murder and sedition now and will be summarily executed".
Then what. Civil war, I guess? All the "moderates" and "undecided" voters would make up their minds pretty quick and vote in whatever ghoul republicans put on the ticket. They'd probably use Biden's action as pretext to crack down on all ideologies left of fascism. Say "trans ideology" is to blame and use the FBI and CIA (which they'll then have complete control over) to imprison LGBT people en masse, then academics, political rivals, "the communists, Marxists, fascists, and the radical left thugs that live like vermin within the confines of our country" as Trump said, etc.
Who knows what would happen, because the entire political landscape would radically change and SCOTUS would never give Biden immunity to do jack shit - they left the ruling sufficiently detailed to stop all prosecution of Trump and grant him immunity for Jan 6, but sufficiently vague that as soon as Biden provides them ammo, they'll immediately use it against the entire Dem establishment.
Unless the Democrats basically ban the GOP from existing by purging them from political life, then Project $Year is inevitable because as you said, it could be any Republican politician. Or do you expect the Democrats to continuously control the White House?
Yep, that is the primary issue. Without making it impossible for the republicans to gain the presidency again, it will happen eventually.