this post was submitted on 24 Dec 2024
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menby

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A space for masculine folks to talk about living under patriarchy.

Detoxing masculinity since 1990!

You don’t get points for feminism, feminism is expected.

Guidelines:

  1. Questions over blame
  2. Humility over pride
  3. Wisdom over dogma
  4. Actions over image

Rules (expansions on the guidelines):

  1. Mistakes should be learning experiences when possible.
    • Do not attack comrades displaying vulnerability for what they acknowledge are mistakes.
    • If you see good-faith behavior that's toxic, do your best to explain why it's toxic.
    • If you don't have the energy to engage, report and move on.
    • This includes past mistakes. If you've overcome extreme reactionary behavior, we'd love to know how.
    • A widened range of acceptable discussion means a greater need for sensitivity and patience for your comrades.
    • Examples:
      • "This is reactionary. Here's why."
      • "I know that {reality}, but I feel like {toxicity}"
      • "I don't understand why this is reactionary, but it feels like it {spoilered details}"
  2. You are not entitled to the emotional labor of others.
    • Constantly info-dumping and letting us sort through your psyche is not healthy for any of us.
    • If you feel a criticism of you is unfair, do not lash out.
    • If you can't engage self-critically, delete your post.
    • If you don't know how to phrase why it's unfair, say so.
  3. No singular masculine ideal.
    • This includes promoting gender-neutral traits like "courage" or "integrity" as "manly".
    • Suggestions for an individual to replace a toxic ideal is fine.
    • Don't reinforce the idea the fulfillment requires masculinity.
    • This also includes tendency struggle-sessions.
  4. No lifestyle content.
    • Post the picture of your new grill in !food (feminine people like grills too smh my head).
    • Post the picture of the fish you caught in !sports (feminine people like fish too smdh my damn head).
    • At best, stuff like this is off-topic. At worst, it's reinforcing genders norms..
    • If you're not trying to be seen as masculine for your lifestyle content, it's irrelevant to this comm. If you are trying to be seen as masculine, let's have a discussion about why these things are seen as masculine.

Resources:

*The Will to Change: Men, Masculinity, and Love by Bell Hooks

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Honestly, I'm here for it. The biphobic stuff I would hear from women kept me in the closet for a long time

https://xcancel.com/guywhoiswoke/status/1871313546266759389

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[–] [email protected] 37 points 2 days ago (7 children)

Wait, that doesn't make sense? 37% of women would date a man who has had sex with another man, but 19% would date a bisexual person? So at least 18% of women would date a straight, gay, or non-bisexual pan man who has had sex with other men just as long as he isn't bi?

[–] [email protected] 54 points 2 days ago* (last edited 2 days ago) (2 children)

Idk and the original survey was in some magazine, no idea how valid those exact figures are. Anecdotally, though a lot of straight women do have that outlook and I'm glad an open discussion is being had.

Also a lot of women jumping into the comments unprompted to say, "What?? Just because I don't want to have sex with a guy who has had disgusting gay sex and probably has AIDS, that makes me homophobic???"

[–] [email protected] 43 points 2 days ago

I regret ever wasting my time trying to appeal to a childish people who thinks like this.

[–] [email protected] 37 points 2 days ago

it doesn't count if you say "no homo" very-smart

[–] [email protected] 39 points 2 days ago

"Yeah my bf fucked another guy, but not in a gay way. Guy on guy is hot as long as I don't have to think of it as a long-term thing."

[–] [email protected] 25 points 2 days ago (1 children)

They're different surveys. The 63% is from a Glamour survey of 1000 women who subscribe to the magazine. The 19% is from South Florida Gay News, but the link wouldn't load for me so idk who they surveyed exactly.

[–] [email protected] 19 points 2 days ago (1 children)

South Florida Gay News better not have surveyed their own audience because I would be very shocked to see that 19% figure came from the LGBTQ community itself.

[–] [email protected] 13 points 2 days ago (1 children)

Well, some gay men also don't like bi guys

[–] [email protected] 4 points 1 day ago

First time I learned that "breeder" was a biphobic slur was because of a woman-hating gay who lost his shit about me dating a woman who didn't take offense to my orientation lmfao

[–] [email protected] 20 points 2 days ago (1 children)

at least some of this might be confused by asking lesbians if theyd date a bi man

[–] [email protected] 11 points 2 days ago* (last edited 2 days ago)

Yeah but it says 19% would date a bisexual person, so I think the survey isn't specific to those who date men. I appreciate that if enough lesbians who wouldn't date bi women (??? also biphobic) answered the survey then it would throw off the numbers for men so maybe the observation I made is inaccurate, but I feel like these numbers aren't adding up.

[–] [email protected] 18 points 2 days ago (1 children)

Is it something to do the first statistic using "man" and the second "person"?

[–] [email protected] 13 points 2 days ago

Men are a subset of people, so there's no reason why opening up the category would restrict the % of women who would date within it.

[–] [email protected] 2 points 1 day ago

It might be a Yes/No/Unsure type of question.