How are they abuse images if no abuse took place to create them?
this post was submitted on 21 May 2024
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If the model was trained on csam then it is dependent on abuse
That's a heck of a slippery slope I just fell down.
If responses generated from AI can be held criminally liable for their training data's crimes, we can all be held liable for all text responses from GPT, since it's being trained on reddit data and likely has access to multiple instances of brigading, swatting, man hunts, etc.
You just summarized the ongoing ethical concerns experts and common folk alike have been talking about in the past few years.
As I said in my other comment, the model does not have to be trained on CSAM to create images like this.
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Because they are images of children being graphically raped, a form of abuse. Is an AI generated picture of a tree not a picture of a tree?
No it isn't, not anymore than a drawing of a car is a real car, or drawings of money are real money.
Material showing a child being sexually abused is child sexual abuse material.
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It's a picture of a hallucination of a tree. Distinguishing real from unreal ought to be taken more seriously given the direction technology is moving.
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All the lemmy.world commenters came out to insist "that painting is a pipe, though."
Yeah? Smoke it.
Lemmy.world and bandwagoning on a sensitive topic that they know nothing about? Classic combo.
You'd figure "CSAM" was clear enough. You'd really figure. But apparently we could specify "PECR" for "photographic evidence of child rape" and people would still insist "he drew PECR!" Nope. Can't. Try again.
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13.000 images are generated relatively fast. My PC needs like 5 seconds for a picture with SD(depending on settings of course). So not even a day.
Also, if pedos would only create their own shit to fap to i would consider this a win.
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Sensitive topic - obviously.
However these guard rail laws, and “won’t someone think about the children” cases are a reeeeally easy way for the government to remove more power from the people.
However, I believe if handled correctly, banning this sort of thing is absolutely necessary to combat the mental illness that is pedophilia.
I don't condone child sexual abuse, and I'm definitely not a pedo (gosh, I can't believe I have to state this.)
But how does banning AI generated material help combating a mental illness? The mental illness will still be there, with or without images...
There's something to be said about making it as difficult as possible to enable the behavior. Though that does run the risk of a particularly frustrated individual doing something despicable to an actual child. I don't exactly have the data on how all this plays out, and frankly I don't want to be the one to look into it. Society isn't particularly equipped to handle an issue like this though, focusing on stigma alone to kinda try to shove it under the rug.
Your second sentence is exactly what I was thinking of. The big issue with pedophilia is the fact that kids can be easily manipulated (or forced!) to do heinous acts. Otherwise, what's the difference with regular porn and topics about prisoners, slavery, necrophilia, etc? Would we say that people who consume rape fantasy porn will go out and rape? If a dude who is sexually attracted to women is not raping women left and right every day all year round, you know, because he knows it's wrong, if we're not labeling every heterosexual male as creeps, then why would this be different with other kinds of attractions?
But anyway. I'm not saying anything that hasn't been discussed in the past (I'm sure.) I'm just glad I don't have that condition (or anything similar, like attracted to volcanoes), otherwise life would definitely suck.
Mainly it’s a problem of enabling the problem as others have mentioned.
It’s not a solution, per se. It doesn’t solve something specifically- but it doesn’t have to be. It’s about making it less accessible, harsher consequences, and so on to put more pressure on not continuing to participate in the activity. Ultimately it boils down to mental health and trauma. Pedophilia is a paraphilic disorder at the end of the day.
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70 years for... Generating AI CSAM? So that's apparently worse than actually raping multiple children?
He did more than generate it, he also sent some of it to a minor on Instagram, probably intending to get some real CSAM, or worse. For that, spending the next 70 years away from both children and computers seems appropriate to me.
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It seems weird that the AI companies aren't being held responsible too.
It's open source code that someone ran on their own computer, it's not like he used paid OpenAI credits to generate the image.
It also would set a bad precedent - it would be like charging Solomons & Fryhle because someone used their (absolutely ubiquitous) organic chemistry textbook to create methamphetamine
Well the American way is not to hold the company accountable, I.e. school shootings, so yeah.
I'm pretty sure you can't hold a school liable for a school shooting
I think they were referring to the firearm manufacturer and\or seller.
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Just to be clear, you guys think that any company that produces anything that ends up used in a crime should have criminal charges for making the product? Yeah, makes about as much sense as anything these days.
Was Kodak ever held responsible for original CSAM?
I think stable diffusion is an open source AI you can run on your own computer, so I don't see how the developers should be held responsible for that.
The basis of making CSAM illegal was that minors are harmed during the production of the material. Prior to CG, the only way to produce pornographic images involving minors was to use real, flesh-and-blood minors. But if no minors are harmed to create CSAM, then what is the basis for making that CSAM illegal?
Think of it this way: if I make a pencil drawing of a minor being sexually abused, should that be treated as though it is a criminal act? What if it's just stick figures, and I've labeled one as being a minor, and the others as being adults? What if I produce real pornography using real adults, but used actors that appear to be underage, and I tell everyone that the actors were all underage so that people believe it's CSAM?
It seems to me that, rationally, things like this should only be illegal when real people are being harmed, and that when there is no harm, it should not be illegal. You can make an entirely reasonable argument that pornographic images created using a real person as the basis does cause harm to the person being so depicted. But if it's not any real person?
This seems like a very bad path to head down.
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