I wasn't going to relitigate this, because I'm tired boss, but I still have to say, even translated to another language, I still don't agree with renaming it to gossip or any equivalent. In addition, this:

While there are some legitimate arguments being made relating to misogynistic societal perceptions of that word, the mods include women and enbies who disagree and specifically requested this name. I feel that this situation parallels the initial pushback that was experienced with disabled in which users voiced concerns that this name could be ableist, but the moderators of that community are themselves disabled and specifically requested that comm name, verbatim.

is exactly why this should have been put to a vote. Why do their voices and preferences matter more than mine? Especially considering at least one of the mods has already admitted they don't even like the thing they're in charge of? Not to mention that, whether intentionally or not, all users are relegated again to some mass of people, while the mods get the nuance of being part of these minority groups - why isn't it noted that the 'legitimate arguments' were also coming from women and enby users? And this parallel you're trying to draw comes off as essentially 'anybody arguing against this is clearly not informed or from the minority group affected', again whether you intend it to or not. Not to mention, if you accept them as legitimate arguments, why are they being cast aside for the personal preference of a handful of mods?

I really think yall have a lot of learning to do.

Editting to add: the more I think on this, the more this whole thing is baffling. We're seriously going to replace 'dunk tank' because of it's racial connotations, and we're going to rename it some variation of 'gossip' in spite of it's sexist connotations. What are we doing here?

"gossip" is a bad name. misogynistic overtones aside, it's just a terrible name. surely, we can think of something better.

While there are some legitimate arguments being made relating to misogynistic societal perceptions of that word, the mods include women and enbies who disagree and specifically requested this name. I feel that this situation parallels the initial pushback that was experienced with disabled in which users voiced concerns that this name could be ableist, but the moderators of that community are themselves disabled and specifically requested that comm name, verbatim.

am i fuckin reading this correctly??? only because some of the people were women and/or enbies, their decisions are now supposed to be the pinnacle of wisdom and uncontestable?

i know that the mods are meaning no harm, i had nothing but positive experiences with them before this whole debacle started, and OP in particular has genuinely been really great at clearing up the current situation, thank you for that, BUT BEING PART OF A MINORITY GROUP DOESN'T ABSOLVE YOU OF BEING WRONG AND JUST REALLY INSENSITIVE IN THIS PARTICULAR SITUATION! all this is a little bit similar to certain trans people stating that they are okay with the t-slur being used on the internet, and while im sure nobody harbors this kind of sentiment in here, i hope this shows what harmful pitfalls this "im Part of a minority group, therefore im right"-thinking can bring.

so to reiterate from my removed thread:

• The term "gossip" has a long history of being weaponized against women, particularly in ways that diminish their voices and portray them as trivial, unimportant, or malicious when engaging in communication or expressing themselves. This cultural baggage doesn’t disappear just because a few people choose to reclaim or adopt the term in a specific context. By using it, the forum risks perpetuating a stereotype that affects gender and sexual minorities who are already marginalized, especially when used as the name of a community meant to serve them.

• some folks from marginalized groups, might want to take back words that have been thrown at them, but it’s a pretty complex thing to do. reclaiming those words means being really aware of how it affects others, especially in places that aim to be welcoming. just picking up a term because some people in the community are cool with it doesn’t really consider the real damage that word might still do to others in that same group. like, using the word "gossip" might give off the vibe that this place isn’t really serious about tackling the bigger issues of sexism that are still out there in society.

• hexbear communities should be all about making sure everyone feels respected and supported, especially those who have often been overlooked. using a word like "gossip" might accidentally push away folks who think it's disrespectful or plays into negative stereotypes about them. Even if some people who identify as women or genderqueer, might not see the term the same way, their views can really depend on their own experiences and privileges.

• one of the key things to building a welcoming space is to watch the words we use, since some can hurt people, even if we don't mean to. just because some folks in the group are cool with certain words doesn’t mean they’re okay for everyone. If we want our community to feel safe and inclusive, we need to think about how our words affect everyone and steer clear of terms that can be harmful.

tldr: it is great that racist terms like the_x_tank are being purged from the site, but it is absolutely not great that potentially sexist terms are being used as a substitute.

The mods of the dunk tank and dredge tank requested the name c/gossip. While there are some legitimate arguments being made relating to misogynistic societal perceptions of that word, the mods include women and enbies who disagree and specifically requested this name.

A few thoughts on this.

First of all, I don’t think this was intentional but using the phrase “women and enbies” in this context can come across as erasure of non-binary identity by implying that it’s akin to “woman lite” - I run a space for people of marginalised genders and this was one of the early lessons we learned, so just passing it on.

Secondly, that female and NB mods suggested a name does not absolve it of flaws or reduce the perception/propagation of misogynistic implications. The majority of people using or seeing the comm won’t know the backstory behind it, and valid concerns about how off-putting the name is shouldn’t be swept aside for these reasons.

Calling it now, counterpropaganda and gossip/el chisme are going to die off and leave slop as a pre-rule 8 dunk tank.

Changing the names is necessary but it should have just been new names that clearly communicate the same intent or content, like The Septic Tank or Barbara Pit. Counterprop isn't going to get much but effort posts about actual propaganda, because the tanks have never focused on specifically countering posts, just mocking them. Gossip sounds like it would either be a celebrity comm or another c/Main, and I'm definitely going to keep forgetting which comm it's replacing. They're bad names that make the intents of the comms unclear and won't have the intended effect on site culture, they'll just change which comm the posts are on.

counterpropaganda is alright

slop is good

gossip is shit

Slop is cool by me, I don't really care about the name thing, it was how everything else went down after that is a real burr under my saddle, i don't think using the Spanish term for gossip really is better tho.

That being said, I didn't even know there was a vote and it's my weekend and I've been at least checking in on my phone here every hour or two today. I'm not unsubbed from anything so it seems odd it didn't show up on my feed ever. I also browse new

I ain't reading all this. You should have come to us bureaucrats for advice first smdh.

JK, love you all! But I'm too busy with the bureaucracy to read this now.

I don't love keeping the name as gossip, nor do I think the parallel is very strong but that is a struggle session for another time. I'm just glad this is over.

Gossip just seems like a sucky name that isn't exactly what we do in the tanks, but whatever. I'm glad this is finally settled and the mods have followed through with the community feedback, it's finally time for our slop now

As a newshog I like the word slop very much. I would like to suggest that slop be appended to every comm. Main slop. News slop. Neurodiverse slop. Slop slop. Gossip slop. and so on

Is it finally over?

Not retaining the tank part of the name is very short sighted. We're going to look back and wish we had tanks, comrades.

Edit: deleted the post, I don't care anymore and will just block the gossip community

Edit 2: I finally understood the purpose of the gossip community as a seperate community with the different function to the old tanks. I don't love the name but I have called myself a gossipmonger so will unblock.

This is not an appropriate place to reopen, re-litigate, or rehash the struggle session.

Since that thread is now locked, is there a place that can be discussed?

I'm upvoting everything here because I just want us all to get along