It's a situation that I have been expecting for a while, but I wasn't fully ready to accept it. Specifically it's one of my LGBTQ friends who honestly believes in the democrats will protect them and their partner. I have tried to make the point that both parties are eroding any sort of civility towards all marginalized groups, but fear seems to drive them more than logical observations. They make the excuse that change doesn't happen over night and that the left continues to grow and will have meaningful affects down the road. I fundamentally just don't agree with that idea and vocalize it regularly. More and more it is ending up in a circular argument where I am painted as unrealistic and my rhetoric (leftist rhetoric) is doing more harm than good because it promotes distrust in the only system we have to work with. I try to tell them it's kind of the whole point. We gotta start somewhere if we want to see a better, more representative system, but they are so hung up on the immediate future while simultaneously saying that my idealistic feelings are shortsighted and I cant expect change in the immediate future... The double-talk is wild, I know.
I am trying my hardest to stop from engaging at this point because on the most basic level we agree on a lot of stuff, but they are just way to wrapped up in the fear mongering of the democratic party. They know that the two party system is broken, they know that something drastic needs to change, but they also think that they are powerless to do anything except choose the lesser evil. It pains me because I am watching them do the same shit past generations have done, where they give up on their ideals for the sake of preserving the current status quo that they benefit from. I am legitimately watching them imply "fuck you, got mine" under the guise of civic duty and I hate it. I want nothing more than to be able to finally say "I told you so" without being a smug asshole about it and ruining our friendship.
Thanks for reading my rant. It's probably a bit disjointed, but the frustration is boiling over and I needed to vent to the only group of people that seems to understand the hopelessness of being a disenfranchised leftist.
Dunno what level of comfort your friend is at, but it really does affect how they react. It's really hard to find real connection for those of us living in Anglo countries.
I feel you. My convos with libs seem like I'm talking to a computer chat bot, the empathy and concern that I'd expect from a real person isn't there. Honestly I usually just limit my lib convos to something simple. For real connections, I find that people become better the further you go from the group in power. So look at middle class cishet white men, and go 180 from there. It's pretty hard to find a genuine person with 3 or more of the above characteristics, although I'm sure that exceptions exist.
I feel exactly the same way. It's called the empathy gap and it's a symptom of racism. This is how they can manage the mental gymnastics of supporting genocide and thinking of themselves as good people. Brown people just matter less to them.
Food for thought. Thanks for the links.
Yeah, I have had zero luck so far finding anyone in my life that feels the way I do. I am accepting the fact that I will need to hold my tongue unless I want all the smoke that comes with upsetting lib sensibilities. I have cut plenty of chuds out of my life already, but I know my lib friends are leaps and bounds better and don't deserve the axe yet. However, they are still not at the level they need to be in order to understand or accept my positions on things.
The thing that kills me the most is when I am told that my positions are detrimental to the greater good. Which in their misguided minds is merely keeping the status quo intact.
It's especially miserable because like I said, they are a gay couple who fears the GOP's outward anti-lgbtq rhetoric more than the DNC's covert anti-lgbtq rhetoric. The specific trigger this time around was the Texas governor that blew a dog whistle about gender in sports. My friend brushed it off as "one democrat doesn't represent all of them", which sounded way to much like thin blue line apologia at this point.
At the end of the day, I am realizing that more people than i thought are actually just run of the mill libs. There is nothing I can do really besides wait for conditions to slide further right and hope they realize it too.
fwiw people are totally out there, even among the libs, that at least give half a shit, or have already given up on the dems. I had a friend come to me last winter, concerned that their (at the time new) SO was on the "fuck biden I aint voting for that old whiteremoved" train, and I had the distinct pleasure of telling them she was right, voting dem does essentially nothing. I was nice about it but like... yeah, good, okay, she sounds based
malcolm x's foxes and wolves
king's negative vs positive peace
There is daylight between the parties on LGBT issues, IMO. Republicans have placed it as a central pillar, with promises to persecute, and we all know the dems won't go to the mat over this. All it will take is a poison pill slipped into a committee and the dems will say they had no choice.
Dems aren't generally looking to actively persecute queer people, they'll cede ground, but the party as a whole isn't building around it. This IS a distinction. There are donors and notable people that the dems may not want to give up readily (Queer orgs donate and volunteer in numbers, and Hollywood actors are mixed in with enough queer people that it's personal for some of them).
Totally understand that, and that is where the erosion comes into play. Dems constantly being ready to cede ground eventually leads to the floodgates opening when the balance of power shifts harder right.
Yeah, it's buying time at best
Yeah I've been hard in on the protest voting / voting for PSL course of action. But the anti-trans ads are giving me serious pause. I know for a fact the Dems don't care about queer people, but they also aren't campaigning on killing them, so there's a genuine distinction there.
I know people don't want to endorse genocide, I wouldn't expect anyone to cast a vote in support of Kopmala due to some moral obligation, quite the opposite. But I think calling the people who are voting for K*pmala genocide apologists or endorsers of genocide is completely wrong. Voting is absolutely an endorsement, don't get me wrong, but these people aren't voting to throw Palestinians under the bus in exchange for not being killed themselves, they genuinely believe that there is no choice in a electoral context to vote against genocide, so they're just choosing the genocide option that doesn't involve them. Many (relatively) of these people would likely risk themselves to stop sending money to Isn'treal if they felt they had the option. But they're convinced they don't.
But, how are we supposed to build socialism if we keep voting for the lesser evil? If we don't even attempt to get actual leftists into positions of power? How are we meant to show people that electoralism is a waste of energy unless we actually push the people and organizations we care about?
It's like a big blackmail scam, and the whole point is to convince people there's no other options but genocide. And the most horrific part of it is that it's true that there's no other options, but only because everyone collectively believes it.
So if I have a friend who actively despises Kopmala but votes for her, I'm still going to talk to them. I don't really approve of it but they're not an inhuman monster. They're just... housebroken.
These people are genuinely pissing themselves levels of scared. They know they have a gun to their head and they've been convinced through a lifetime that trying to take the gun will always end in them dying. And they think that no matter what they do the person holding the gun to their head will kill a bunch of other people regardless.
if they are quiet about it and vote on election day, I honestly don't care all that much.
I just can't stand the people who just immediately accept months out from November that "these are the candidates and these are their policies and you can do nothing about it so I am going to vocally support Kopmala and browbeat anyone who says they won't or is critical of her"
Ya you don't need to cut ties with libs, maybe do hobbies and other stuff together. But hold your tongue similar to how you would at work. In the end of the day, they're not your comrades. Maybe drop a word here and there to try to radicalise them, but don't hold any hope up.
I'd suggest to join an org, and try to have more poor friends if that's possible. I know it ain't easy though.
Yeah, I have no intention of cutting ties with them, but have realized that holding my tongue will do wonders for my own mental health as well as the relationships that are based on more than just politics. Like I have said, I dont keep many people around me that dont believe in the same core values, it's just that i put more weight on them in my day to day life. I love treats as much as the next lib, but I don't willfully ignore the damage done in the process of getting the treats. I act in a way to limit that damage even if it means less treats.
Joining an org is an option, would need to be more digital tho, I dont like the public lol.
Can I ask why you don't want to do public? IRL friends are the best.
Anxiety mostly, but I don't think its very healthy to keep succumbing to the feelings. COVID is also the huge factor, but I still mask everywhere I go, so I can solve that problem easily. So it comes back to social anxiety that I do definitely need to work through.
I have no advice on Covid, but I just wanted to mention that the anxiety might be worth it, especially since the anxiety will go away eventually but the relationships should at least last somewhat longer if they are worth anything.
FWIW I'd say your lib friends deserve the axe they're voting for (not that you need to axe them off socially yourself). I get the fears, not AmeriKKKan but from another Anglo country, and as an ethnic Chinese (no PRC citizenship/ties or I'd be packing and planning to leave already lol), queer and trans, coming from an immigrant family and being a naturalized citizen (as a kid) myself, and of course being a commie... well shit's bad. But those who want to toss others under the bus to literal industrial genocide deserve whatever they get if you ask me- and today it's the Palestinians and now the Lebanese, eventually down the line if they don't come under the empire's crosshairs first, it'll be (already is in some considerable level) you and other leftist dissent, or the various other demographics (of fellow citizens) already being stomped down/colonized within the empire...
Hopefully they can learn and become better people. I get how it is, about not wanting to cut them off fully (though also not wanting to talk, that shit is nauseating).
I just tell libs that if they really want Kamala to win, GOTV is historically much more effective than arguing about it. It's my thought-terminating cliché that masks my apathy for their cause with the vaguest sentiment of goodwill.