964
Elon Musk supports eliminating voting rights for people without children
(www.independent.co.uk)
this post was submitted on 03 Jul 2023
964 points (94.1% liked)
politics
19144 readers
2574 users here now
Welcome to the discussion of US Politics!
Rules:
- Post only links to articles, Title must fairly describe link contents. If your title differs from the site’s, it should only be to add context or be more descriptive. Do not post entire articles in the body or in the comments.
Links must be to the original source, not an aggregator like Google Amp, MSN, or Yahoo.
Example:
- Articles must be relevant to politics. Links must be to quality and original content. Articles should be worth reading. Clickbait, stub articles, and rehosted or stolen content are not allowed. Check your source for Reliability and Bias here.
- Be civil, No violations of TOS. It’s OK to say the subject of an article is behaving like a (pejorative, pejorative). It’s NOT OK to say another USER is (pejorative). Strong language is fine, just not directed at other members. Engage in good-faith and with respect! This includes accusing another user of being a bot or paid actor. Trolling is uncivil and is grounds for removal and/or a community ban.
- No memes, trolling, or low-effort comments. Reposts, misinformation, off-topic, trolling, or offensive. Similarly, if you see posts along these lines, do not engage. Report them, block them, and live a happier life than they do. We see too many slapfights that boil down to "Mom! He's bugging me!" and "I'm not touching you!" Going forward, slapfights will result in removed comments and temp bans to cool off.
- Vote based on comment quality, not agreement. This community aims to foster discussion; please reward people for putting effort into articulating their viewpoint, even if you disagree with it.
- No hate speech, slurs, celebrating death, advocating violence, or abusive language. This will result in a ban. Usernames containing racist, or inappropriate slurs will be banned without warning
We ask that the users report any comment or post that violate the rules, to use critical thinking when reading, posting or commenting. Users that post off-topic spam, advocate violence, have multiple comments or posts removed, weaponize reports or violate the code of conduct will be banned.
All posts and comments will be reviewed on a case-by-case basis. This means that some content that violates the rules may be allowed, while other content that does not violate the rules may be removed. The moderators retain the right to remove any content and ban users.
That's all the rules!
Civic Links
• Congressional Awards Program
• Library of Congress Legislative Resources
• U.S. House of Representatives
Partnered Communities:
• News
founded 1 year ago
MODERATORS
you are viewing a single comment's thread
view the rest of the comments
view the rest of the comments
Notice how you cannot asnwer questions directly posed to you. The truth is, bud, you haven't made an argument yet. I probably got you pegged-- You dont have strong feelings about civics, you have strong feelings about Twitter/Musk. Its alright, but dont think you've done anything but flounder there with your arms crossed thinking Ill go away. WHY shouldnt Canadians be allowed to vote? Why are the current limitations cool (or not)? Make an argument, lol. Say something. Surprise me :p
Ah, proving me right. Sealioning for EviDenCe then denying it when its linked. "Cant provide me ANY evidence!" Classic Reddit. I dont think the study is boring because its weak, I think its boring because its from pubmed. Heres some more truly mind blowing research on drug use. You'll be shocked and fascinated, Im sure. Marijuana is bad for short term memory? Why, its basically synonymous with short-sightedness... Dont tell me that instant-gratification isnt a virtue! No!
I think you're right that my negative reaction to the study sort of poisoned the water. Yet I dont believe for a second that a PubMed study ever changed your mind about anything. I dont think you understand why I linked to the Replication Crisis. And I think you believe there is a study for every imginable topic. Its... its... hahahaha :]
Oof. Delusional. Not sure why I’ve even wasted as much time as I have replying to you. The projection claiming I’ve made no argument when you are supposed to be the one arguing for why only parents should vote…lmao
And no, I don’t care about twitter or musk at all to be honest. I’ve never had a twitter account and I don’t have strong feelings on Musk other than the obvious fact that he’s clearly not as smart as he thinks he is. So you’ve got me pegged wrong there, good work.
I have actually responded why Canadians shouldn’t vote but apparently it was too complex of an answer for you. But yeah I’m not going to just sit here arguing random points you feel like bringing up because you still have zero argument for what we are actually discussing.
Your answer for why only parents should be able to vote so far has been “why not let Canadians vote?” Which is so fucking stupid and when I point that out you go “see?? You can’t even argue why not only parents should be able to vote by arguing why Canadians shouldn’t be able to vote! Logical fallacies!” I haven’t even asked for a single study. I’ve asked for evidence. It can be anything. The best you have so far is a study that shows people slow down a little bit on smoking weed when they have kids that even you admitted is nothing.
This conversation has essentially been that image of the pigeon knocking over all the chess pieces and shitting on the board while claiming they won. Congrats, pigeon.
Jeez D00d, your comprehension levels... Yeesh. You STILL have made no reasoned argument as to WHY Canada shouldn't be allowed. You just said that 'it doesnt effect them.' I told you why it does. You are now insisting that you made an attempt. You didnt :] Again, if its so easy then do it.
My positon was all the way at the top. Its that 'parents are (more) invested in the future.' Its pretty simple, tbh. You asked for eVidEncE, I gave you something corroborating (nonparents use drugs at higher rates which insinuates a lack of investment toward the future). You didnt think it was enough, so I gave you more (how drug use lessens functional memory, something parents need a lot). Now you're saying I never provided any evidence. Honk honk.
Okay heres some more evidence: "Men are more likely than women to give no parental investment to their children, and the children of low-investing fathers are more likely to give less parental investment to their own children... Daughters of absent fathers are more likely to seek short-term partners, and one theory explains this as a preference for outside (non-partner) social support because of the perceived uncertain future and uncertain availability of committing partners in a high-stress environment. [Emphasis added]
Apparently babies will innately understand the future-investment concept. But will you? :p
No, I said foreigners don’t need representation in the US government. Way to oversimplify my point. And then you bitch about my comprehension skills.
Okay dude, we get it. You have literally no argument or evidence for why only parents should be allowed to vote, just a vague and empty claim that they care more about the future (as if at least half of parents don’t vote for regressive policies).
I’m not sure how the behavior of children with absent fathers is even remotely relevant to this discussion (other than support my point that parents can be pieces of shit).
Here is a more relevant study: Having a daughter makes parents more likely to vote Republican:
https://www.pewresearch.org/short-reads/2013/11/25/study-having-daughters-makes-parents-more-likely-to-be-republican/
So is your argument that society is better if more people vote Republican, which is notorious for having no platform and supports regressive policies?
This is not an explanation as to WHY foreigners shouldn't vote. You are merely regurgitating our existing rules. Surly you get this :p Again: Canada shares thousands of miles or borders, they're our trade partners, they share many of our values. We are a meltingpot nation built of foreigners... There are reasons why we could. But you know its inherintly bankrupt, which is fine, because it is a bankrupt idea. I'd love to tell you reasons why, but thats kind of your onus at this point.
I think absent parents are synonymous with nonparents. They're literally not parenting, lol. I know, Im not a lingustic expert but I think most people would agree. I think this is actually a breakthrough for us. You seem to think parenting is the act of having children, I think parenting is the act of raising children. Interesting.
Im not really taken by your partisanism or your (boring) research :p Oh, dont get all bent up, notice how you are not persuaded by evidence-based argumentation despite spending 1/2 our time demanding it. Its a funny life.
It’s absolutely a reason why they shouldn’t vote. They don’t pay taxes here, they don’t need or deserve representation because of this. It’s so simple you are unable to grasp it.
That’s great that you think that, but legally they are still a parent with a child so by Musks suggestion, they’d still be able to vote. You seem to be confusing philosophical thought exercises with legal definitions and real world applications.
So let me know if you ever come up with some evidence that suggests limiting voters to parents only would be a net benefit. Again, doesn’t need to be studies. Isn’t there some research on voting patterns and ideals of parents vs non-parents? I already gave one example but it doesn’t support your argument, quiet the opposite exactly. Your one study showed that parents don’t stop smoking weed, just slow down a little bit, so you can’t really argue they are better because they don’t smoke weed since that’s not true.
Until then, feel free to respond with more nonsense, I’ll just stop responding until you formulate an actual argument for your position.
We just had a breakthrough :] Canadians don't pay taxes. That's right! Finally some insight from you. Is it presumptuous for me to think you're cool with this limitation? What about other current limitations? What about literacy... How will the illiterate make their selections otherwise? Are you really a member of society if you dont know the language... However many think that this would be 'voter suppression.' The bar is literally that low.
Ive known of plenty of people who've had their children removed from their custody. Are they still 'parenting' when their child is a ward of the State? There is nuance to be found here. Not to mention the actual legal definition isn't as you claim...
So smoking less weed is not an improvement? They should instead just keep smoking joints in the living room with the toddler at the TV? Surely this doesnt actually appeal to you. Smoking less weed means more net-income and more short-term memory. This is not controversial.
Imagine doing so little to move the conversation and being indignant about the way it goes :]
I pointed out the tax thing already, like 12 hours and 6 comments ago.
You aren’t even reading my replies properly, I’m over talking in circles with someone that uses brackets to make a smiley face and can’t formulate an argument that actually uses the topic we are discussing.
Maybe next time try arguing for something that actually has some legs and you believe in yourself. You aren’t good at arguing for things that you don’t actually agree with.
You really didn't. You made some vauge statment about being a 'taxpaying member of society.' When Im in Canada I pay (sales) tax and follow thier (societal) laws. And vice versa. You can be a Canadian working in the US, integrating into our society, and paying (dual) income tax without citizenship... Granted there are tax credits to retroactively return some of the double-taxing... Also, a 16 year old in the States can work a taxable job, should they vote? Theres nuance to be had.
I think it's fair to say that you like having a system where entry to vote is as low as possible. However, way back to the beginning, it says nothing about being knowledgeable or virtuous. If anything it insinuates that you don't actually respect the two. Or you just belittle your own knowledge and virtue.
No, it’s not fair to say that at all. I’ve stated nothing about my personal beliefs beyond saying that what Elon is suggesting is stupid. You are trying SO HARD to put words in my mouth it’s hilarious.
This entire conversation only makes a lick of sense to me if I assume you are on the spectrum, so I’ll give you some grace and we can both move on with our lives. Before you scream “ad hominem attack!!11,” you need to have a position for me to ignore that and attack you instead. But you have no position.
You seem like the kind of guy that needs the last word, so go ahead. I’ll stop replying.
✌️
;]