this post was submitted on 05 Apr 2024
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Why do people here really not like Trotskyists? Is it just because of his beef with Stalin and not an actual criticism of his views? Do people really not think a global movement would be superior for the betterment of all people?

Edit: Thank you to everyone who provided context and history, y’all are a wealth of knowledge.

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[–] [email protected] 56 points 8 months ago* (last edited 8 months ago) (1 children)

It's a meme cuz in the cringe world international-community-1international-community-2 two or three whole generations turned out to be plants or genuine reactionary dipshits, and in the rest of the world they were innefective while always shitting on AES

In any case, as any other leftist they are always annoying and the True One Leftists

[–] [email protected] 5 points 8 months ago* (last edited 8 months ago) (4 children)

Okay but I kiiinda get the feeling y'all don't actually want socialism for the western world, you just want it to burn. Like if America became AES, people would still yell death to Amerikkka.

Edit: Sorry this was an incredibly idealist take by me.

[–] [email protected] 27 points 8 months ago* (last edited 8 months ago) (1 children)

if America became AES it would necessarily involve decolonization. What would remain would hopefully not resemble the current formation, culture, or arrangement of America. Hopefully it wouldn't even be called the same thing, or perhaps wouldn't be a single country but perhaps even a loose confederation of indigenous nations and whatever remains in-between

It would be like saying we would also hate Israel if it became socialist. Yeah no shit, because Israel shouldn't exist. So yea I'm always going to hate Amerikkka unless it's stripped bare and the racism purged through decolonization, no matter how nominally socialist it gets

Maybe you come from a place that isn't a settler colony so maybe that sort of perspective is lost on you?

[–] [email protected] 10 points 8 months ago (1 children)

Yeah, this was an extremely poor analogy, I have left it up as a testament to my stupidity

[–] [email protected] 22 points 8 months ago

you're not stupid if you were able to listen to your comrades and learn from it

[–] [email protected] 21 points 8 months ago (1 children)

Okay but I kiiinda get the feeling y'all don't actually want socialism for the western world, you just want it to burn.

It depends. When you say "socialism in the Western world" do you mean redistribution of all of the West's plundered resources, land, and labor back to the Global South and indigenous peoples, or do you mean taking Elon's shit because some global northerners feel like they deserve a bigger share of the plundered superprofits?

[–] [email protected] 6 points 8 months ago* (last edited 8 months ago) (1 children)

Yes, I would love global communism.

Which is what, to my understanding, Trotskyism argued for. But yeah, plenty of people have pointed out even if his writings point to that, in practice that is not really how Trotskyists act.

[–] [email protected] 20 points 8 months ago (1 children)

Cool yeah then we're on the same page. I just personally think that when most Westerners talk about socialism they just want free heath care and longer holidays and who cares about where the resources that sustain that lifestyle come from?

[–] [email protected] 5 points 8 months ago* (last edited 8 months ago) (2 children)

Which is exactly why I think it's important for the proletariat to be connected across state boundaries. Allows people to better understand current issues outside their own experience and what would have to be done to correct them. If two neighboring countries with vastly different natural resource reserves are both socialist and both countries allow free flow of trade (which I think any two socialist states should), it helps everyone involved.

[–] [email protected] 11 points 8 months ago

Just because MLs reject permanent revolution doesn't mean they reject internationalism.

[–] [email protected] 11 points 8 months ago

In theory I agree with you but in practice I think many Western leftists need to develop some humility and willingness to engage as equals rather than talking down to non-Westerners.

[–] [email protected] 17 points 8 months ago* (last edited 8 months ago) (1 children)

Sounds like you are whinning about an extremely far hypothetical to try to hide your desire of whining about people chanting death to amerikkka today.

Pathetic.

[–] [email protected] 4 points 8 months ago* (last edited 8 months ago) (1 children)

Lol, not at all. Who was chanting death to amerikkka today? Maybe read the rest of my comments to help you understand that's not what I am talking about.

[–] [email protected] 15 points 8 months ago* (last edited 8 months ago) (1 children)

stuff I may or may not have it as ringtone

[–] [email protected] 1 points 8 months ago (1 children)
[–] [email protected] 5 points 8 months ago* (last edited 8 months ago)

To me either the US gets cool or we all die (because of the US), no in between