this post was submitted on 25 Feb 2024

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Socialist Alternative publishes "China collapsing any day now" article. (www.socialistalternative.org)

submitted 8 months ago by [email protected] to c/[email protected]

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[–] [email protected] 58 points 8 months ago (4 children)

2023 was a disastrous year for the economy and for Xi Jinping’s regime. 2024 is already shaping up to be worse. China has not been rocked by major protests since the short-lived 2022 movement. These protests were crushed by a wave of arrests but not before bringing about the collapse of Xi Jinping’s brutal zero-COVID policy.

What is the point of being Socialist if you're just going to parrot this shit?

[–] [email protected] 28 points 8 months ago

brutal zero-COVID policy

brutality is when you don't want to let a deadly disease kill millions of innocent people

[–] [email protected] 14 points 8 months ago

That's what you get when your "reporting" is just re-hashing mainstream media

[–] [email protected] 6 points 8 months ago (2 children)

Are the protests rocking China a reference to a real thing?

[–] [email protected] 22 points 8 months ago (1 children)

Yes, there were big protests against Zero Covid after a while. The absurd thing about the narrative of it being "brutal" and "totalitarian" is that the Zero Covid policies were all carried out by neighborhood volunteer organizations, not the police or the military. When the protests started, the central government quickly realized that the only way to keep enforcing it would be through the kind of overwhelming police crackdown that the western press imagined was happening, so they ended the policy instead. What happened does possibly signal a new future for Chinese politics, but not for the reasons that this article or the liberal western press says:

Politics In Command? – China In The New Era And That Interesting Little Thing That Happened In November 2022

Add Oil! – The Tragedy of Zero-Covid

[–] [email protected] 17 points 8 months ago

like you said, the protests were actually representative of how democratic the Chinese government is. people got sick of the COVID policies, started protesting for a few weeks? months? and the Chinese government instantly responded and started loosening restrictions.

can you imagine anything similar in a Western country? people have been protesting the genocide of Palestinians since October 7th and the Biden regime is just saying "fuck you, vote for us or you're supporting Trump". no one even thinks protests do anything anymore.

[–] [email protected] 6 points 8 months ago

Afaik there were several protests in cities where the quarantine was handled poorly, more a "where is the food you promised us" and less "we hate your entire government"

[–] [email protected] 5 points 8 months ago

This reads like a Breitbart article

[–] [email protected] 43 points 8 months ago (2 children)

Bro, wtf is it with trots? I bought a book recently about trans history and politics, and it's written by trots.

90% of the book is fine. Good, even! But there's a chapter going over a brief history of transness, and there's a subsection called "Totalitarian transphobia" and it talks about Paragraph 175 under the Nazis, rollbacks on queer rights under Stalin, and the continuation of paragraph 175 in West Germany. So far, nothing objectionable.

But then it gets to East Germany, which repealed Paragraph 175 decades before the west, and made great strides in queer rights for the time. East Germany is such an interesting, complex, nuanced, and fascinating part of socialist and queer history. And how does this book handle it?

One paragraph that says "East Germany repealed Paragraph 175 much sooner than the west. But gay men were still arbitrarily imprisoned under stalinist rule".

BABE, WHAT? I get it, Trots have to label any ML socialist project as "Stalinist". It's a thought terminating cliche of theirs. But there's such an interesting contradiction in that sentence, and there's zero attempt to explore it's ramifications.

On the one hand, I respect my Trot comrades for their commitment to genuine labor militancy. But holy shit do they such a deep disinterest in grappling with any leftist tendency outside of their own, in good faith.

[–] [email protected] 23 points 8 months ago (1 children)

The concept of totalitarianism was conceived of and pushed by a number of influential losers who wanted to give their personal vendettas a grand philosophical justification, so this tracks

[–] [email protected] 4 points 8 months ago (2 children)

Who? Genuine question.

[–] [email protected] 12 points 8 months ago

Western scholars in the aftermath of WW2, trying to find some way to connect the Nazis with the evil commies, and basically invented all that horseshoe theory nonsense in the process. I don't think it was anyone specific, more a general push in western academia to vilify the USSR with a term so vague and meaningless it could be applied to any government.

[–] [email protected] 7 points 8 months ago

Hannah Arendt

[–] [email protected] 12 points 8 months ago (1 children)

what book was it

[–] [email protected] 8 points 8 months ago* (last edited 8 months ago) (2 children)

It's called Transgender Resistance: Socialism and The Fight for Trans Liberation by Laura Miles

I don't wanna completely rag on this book, Chapter 6: Trans Voices Around The World, for example, is genuinely really good, and brings into focus the histories and experiences of trans people in the global south.

Something that a book like Transgender Warriors by Leslie Feinberg only briefly touches upon, outside of its main narrative, via pictures and short captions.

Speaking of Feinberg, this really gets me about Trot cognitive dissonance about "Stalinism". The book makes regular (and tbh unavoidable, given their importance) reference to Feinberg. And for that matter Sylvia Rivera is on the front cover.

Feinberg was in the Workers World Party, and Rivera was in the Young Lords. They're exactly the "Stalinists" the author condems in that subsection that I was complaining about! Yet they're on the cover of the book, and peppered throughout the reference notes, without a hint of irony.

Tbh it's a result of the western leftist cult of failure, that pervades everything. The best movements are the ones that are pure. Pure movements lost, and thus never had to contend with the complexities of actually governing. So a "stalinist" movement that never succeeded can be claimed as pure and good, rather than evil and totalitarian, despite them literally sharing an ideology.

[–] [email protected] 7 points 8 months ago* (last edited 8 months ago)

yeah i know some people working on a book that surprisingly havent heard about this, handed it off to them

and yes, there is an ongoing issue in queer spaces that we have become severed from our radical traditions despite being radicals ourselves. a lot of our 'ancestors' died a little too early to properly teach and mentor the next generation on successes and failures, so we're picking up the scraps from people that were lucky enough to live long

[–] [email protected] 3 points 8 months ago* (last edited 8 months ago)

honestly, upon reading this, there is very little original work here, its mostly citing a bunch of news articles (including quite a lot of washington post) and wagging her finger at global south countries. if you pay close attention to /r/transgender or something you could get most of this info yourself.

all so very english of her

a book like this really needs more input from other trans people as well, its unhelpful for her to expound on lgbt issues in africa when she herself is not african or has never visited africa or has never interviewed an african trans woman. there is also the issue of grouping all of africa into one section, when it is incredibly diverse. by not interviewing people directly, she is simply regurgitating information straight from western propaganda outlets and loses a lot of nuance in every story and the potential of learning secretive information about each trans community (re: historical information, justifications, etc.) .

[–] [email protected] 40 points 8 months ago (1 children)

biden-horror "Oh God NO!! They...have enough stuff"

[–] [email protected] 32 points 8 months ago

Scarcity mindset west whywhywhywhywhy vs abundance mindset China xigma-male

[–] [email protected] 31 points 8 months ago (1 children)

Having more houses then needed isn’t a bad thing.

[–] [email protected] 27 points 8 months ago

A surplus of goods is literally the foundation of communism, so good job China. Of course the US would smear that, for neoliberalism the foundation is something like a scarcity of housing thus driving up demand for housing and the profits of the rentier class.

[–] [email protected] 30 points 8 months ago* (last edited 8 months ago) (1 children)

Last month on On Strike!: US-China Cold War is a Disaster for Working People

This new Cold War between US imperialism and Chinese imperialism impacts every aspect of the world situation today, from the war in Ukraine to the war on Gaza to climate change.

pika-pickaxe

[–] [email protected] 1 points 8 months ago* (last edited 8 months ago)

I found a YouTube link in your comment. Here are links to the same video on alternative frontends that protect your privacy:

[–] [email protected] 26 points 8 months ago

~~Socialist~~ Liberal Alternative

[–] [email protected] 24 points 8 months ago

See more at Chinaworker.info

Okay.....

[–] [email protected] 21 points 8 months ago (1 children)

SA plz why you gotta be like that

[–] [email protected] 25 points 8 months ago* (last edited 8 months ago)

Its literally their name, an alternative to socialism..

[–] [email protected] 18 points 8 months ago

surprised-pika

Trots do trot shit

[–] [email protected] 18 points 8 months ago

Comparing China and Japan is so silly.

[–] [email protected] 15 points 8 months ago

They were against China's COVID measures. So, this doesn't surprise me.

[–] [email protected] 14 points 8 months ago

Wtf... Trots aren't usually like that shit...

Sure, they're 'anti-Stalinists', which makes them anti-Marxist Leninist, by a nature and co-optable by the western imperialists... but they usually have more self-respect to stick to their own lane and criticize these western powers and capitalism, if not praise some elements of AES...

Australian Labor government announces major naval build-up directed against China

WORKPLACE SAFETY NOW BETTER IN CHINA THAN IN AUSTRALIA - Trotskyist platform

Then again, that's only some Trots...

[–] [email protected] 14 points 8 months ago

Trot moment

[–] [email protected] 5 points 8 months ago (1 children)

Is investing in China's manufacturing a good thing to do with money?

[–] [email protected] 7 points 8 months ago (1 children)

I am by no means a finance guy, but I would assume that would have been something to do in the 80s-90s. Now I think the thing to do is to invest in whatever nations China is assisting with their belt and road initiative. Like I said tho I have nothing to base that off of other than intuition.

[–] [email protected] 4 points 8 months ago (1 children)

I could have been more specific, I was thinking more like "is it praxis to give money to China?" Like if you chose to not be a land lord and instead put the resources towards Xi crushing the west under China's mighty heel would you go to communist heaven and get to shake Stalin's hand?

[–] [email protected] 4 points 8 months ago

Oh then unironically buying US bonds would be the best way because that’s what we use to pay our debts to China lmfao. Pretty much just by living in the United States you are essentially paying for the People’s Liberation Army in a round about way.

[–] [email protected] 5 points 8 months ago

Anyway, here's a counterpoint

[–] [email protected] 3 points 8 months ago* (last edited 8 months ago)

Did ISA hire Gordon Chang or something, lmao