What happens to you or me if we stiff the IRS for half a mill?
this post was submitted on 06 Oct 2023
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Nothing.
To owe 500,000 in taxes probably means you have enough money that the IRS wouldn’t go after you.
Now if you owe them $50? Straight to jail you disgusting poor.
I bet the real answer is more nuanced than this.
More complex, yes, but not in the way you seem to think. The IRS is chronically underfunded and going after the rich is much more expensive since they have more complicated finances and a lot of expensive lawyers to fight it, so they usually aren't audited.
Also, the entire "justice" system is made by the rich and powerful to benefit themselves over everyone else.
You are right and wrong.
If you make probably around 200k or less, your taxes are pretty simple. You have some very basic filings like a 1080 and some mortgage items. Maybe you have some income from stock sales.
That’s about it. (Ignoring retirement and other still basic and easily calculated tax affecting numbers.).
If you get it wrong, they have all of the paperwork and can easily flag what doesn’t match.
If you are making way more, you probably have businesses and a weird intermingling of finances. Our tax structure just says “tell us what you think” and they take it as fact unless it is checked out. A businesses tax filing might be hundreds of pages long with tons of “I think x is value y and it depreciated by z amount” which of course is hugely subjective and not objective. And that’s the least complex part.
To audit those numbers can take hundreds of hours to get to understand what’s going on and where to go. We need to close loopholes and remove the subjectivity of our taxes for the rich and to dedicate resources in the irs to just this complex type tax auditing.
Not to mention remove the need for a 1080 or any other basic taxable form. Go to a website, see what it says you owe, view the calculation and give us the ability to challenge it if it’s wrong with simple paperwork.
You're absolute right, but what was I wrong about? You basically elaborated on what I said and then added a common sense solution at the end 🤷
Both the loopholes and the unnecessarily complicated process are put there on purpose though, by rich people who don't want to pay taxes and corporations like Intuit (TurboTax) H&R Block and TaxAct Holdings who want people to have no reasonable alternative to paying them to do it.
Because it's not about the amount of money or the ability to fight it, it's about the way the income or other wealth was generated. The IRS audits the rich all the time, it's just easier to have someone fix a mistake or catch tax evasion/fraud when the underlying income/wealth is only generated from a few sources. If you make 7 figures because that's your salary, it's still pretty easy to audit you.
Because it's not about the amount of money or the ability to fight it, it's about the way the income or other wealth was generated
Above a certain threshold of wealth is ONLY achievable through complex and/or shady means and it's the norm way below that threshold.
Rich people generate wealth in more and different ways than regular people.
The IRS audits the rich all the time
Nope. They audit poor and middle class people MUCH more, even proportionately.
If you make 7 figures because that's your salary, it's still pretty easy to audit you.
Nobody with a 7 figure salary doesn't own stock and/or property too. That's how the system works: the more money you have, the more opportunities you have to get more and the more eagerly your bank and/or accountant urges you to invest.
The difficulty is not intentional. It is knee jerk reactions that were poorly implemented from years and years of built up changes to how money is made (or hidden). Compounded on more and more with law over law. Just Don’t attribute malice to that which can be considered incompetence.
As for being wrong, that was too harsh. I don’t think the irs ignores the rich per se, but it’s just really difficult to quickly understand if they are following the rules. The time investment is very high and they don’t have dedicated people. It isn’t intentional though so your fix is either fund with a rule the funding only goes to six figure tax bill collection or fix the laws to make the information objective only and non complex while controlling loopholes .
Ask Wesley Snipes.
Yeah, but he's black.
What happens to white people if we stiff the IRS for half a mill? Judging by Nicolas Cage, nothing.
We would negotiate a payment plan and make installment payments. And if we fell behind they would file a tax lien on our assets.
Hey, that's exactly what they did with Rudy!
Imagine not having to pay taxes.
It sure sucks being an average person.
Great; now put him where they put Wesley Snipes.
Is this a Demolition Man reference?
This is a 2011-2013 reference
real life spoiler
Wesley Snipes went to jail for tax evasion and server 28 months
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wesley_Snipes#Income_tax_conviction
Oh boring.
I vote we lock him up in the sci-fi dystopian prison.
Yeah, but then he gets to come back.
Not really the same sort of case at all. Wesley didn't file returns for years despite earning millions in that time, his accountant wilfully violated the law, and when the IRS asked for the money anyway, he responded with a bunch of sovereign citizen bullshit.
Guilliani is under a formal payment plan with the IRS, and I assume from the lien he fell behind on payments.
How do you walk around owing this much money?
Well, it's more of a waddle/shuffle.
Here's my guess as both an employee who owes tens of thousands of back taxes and an employer with employees that I sometimes receive garnishment notices for...
Because he isn't in one place all the time, because I assume his payments come from a variety of ever-changing sources, and I imagine because Trump & Co just throw garnishment notices in the trash - they haven't been able to do much.
I mean, eventually they might show up at his doorstep (rare as far as I know). The last time I heard that happening was legitimately ignoring notices for 3-4 years.
The IRS is understaffed and underfunded for a reason. And it sucks.
They're fixing the last line of that. Republicans parred it back some it's still seeing substantial budget increases. You can see the 10 year timelines.
The tax enforcement budget would see a 69.2% increase relative to the pre-IRA projection. I forget what the size of the debt limit deal cutback was, but my recollection is that it was not enough to change the core fact that the IRS is going to see substantial improvements to its budget and especially to its enforcement arm.
EDIT: Worth highlighting that stories like this one are exactly why republicans hate the idea of the IRS being properly funded.
Awesome.
I like that they saw The Daily Mail reporting on it and waited for a better source, like you always should with the worst tabloid in the world.
That being said, this is one of the least surprising headlines I've read all year 🤷
Old, drunk and broke. What a way to go through the last of your life,
He could have retired as "America's Mayor," had all the shit he had done before 9/11 swept under the rug, and coasted for the rest of his life. Instead he hitched his wagon to an even bigger conman, and will die destitute.
He could have but he was compromised by Russia.
Getting to the "old" part seems like an achievement.
For the person, it's better than the alternative
This degenerate owes all his ex wives more. I guess co starring in Borat 2 didn’t pay much.
Got some perv points out of it.
Al Capwnd?
Hopefully what goes around comes around. I do wonder how much Trump owes him in legal fees? Would love to see that boil over when the screws tighten
This is the best summary I could come up with:
Former Trump attorney Rudy Giuliani owes more than half a million dollars in federal taxes and faces a lien on a property he owns in Florida, according to a recent court filing.
The unpaid balance of $549,435.26 in federal taxes for 2021 was revealed in an August notice that said the IRS was placing a lien on Giuliani's property in Palm Beach, Florida.
The Daily Mail first reported Giuliani’s tax debt, which comes as he faces mounting legal woes, and fees.
Last month, Giuliani's former lawyers sued him over allegations that he had not paid legal fees that they said amounted to $1.36 million.
Reached for comment Thursday about the unpaid federal taxes, Ted Goodman, a spokesperson for Giuliani, said: “Mayor Giuliani is suing Joe Biden for defamation, and I get asked about a potential tax issue.
NBC News reported last month that Trump hosted a fundraiser at his golf club in Bedminster, New Jersey, to help a legal defense fund for Giuliani, who was charged alongside him and 17 other people in the Georgia election interference case.
The original article contains 272 words, the summary contains 178 words. Saved 35%. I'm a bot and I'm open source!
Wonder if he got paid extra to refer to his client as "Mayor Giuliani".
Creepy old motherfucker hasn't been the mayor of shit for 22 years.