this post was submitted on 09 Mar 2024
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food

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Off the top of my head:

India:
Sugar
Pepper
Basil
Mangoes
Bananas
Ginger
(Ceylon) Cinnamon

SEA:
(Cassia) Cinnamon
Mace
Nutmeg
Oranges
Lemons
Limes

Central Asia:
Apples
Carrots (Afghanistan, could be considered MENA or India but the MENA category is too OP)

East Asia:
Peaches
Soy Sauce
Ketchup
Soy sauce
Sesame oil

Africa:
Coffee
Coca-Cola
Palm oil

Americas:
Chocolate
Vanilla
Blueberries
Potatoes
Tomatoes
Corn
Pineapple
Strawberries

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[–] [email protected] 57 points 6 months ago* (last edited 6 months ago) (6 children)

Daily reminder that the idea of "national" cuisine is inherently nationalist, food doesn't follow borders or skin color and pretending it does only plays into ethnonationalist ideals.
All food everywhere is a result of immigrants influencing local cultures, local climate, local needs. Seeing others take something you grew up with and give their own twist on it should invite joy in your heart, it is a sign of appreciation and respect that others would love a part of your life so dearly, that they would wish to replicate it. The fact that they attempt to modify it to make it into something that they can consider a part of their everyday meals is only a grander sign of love. The fact that we can share and incorporate each others produce, practice and recipes is a wonderful and cool thing that should be celebrated, not something to be used as a cringy dunk that really only exposes your own ass for not having a coherent logical framework.
Pretending like the meal you hold dearly isn't also a product of that same process of immigration, appreciation, appropriation and procreation, is inherently reactionairy.

I guess this is some dumbass American thing I am not capable of understanding. You guys seem to suck at cooking, it seems like food is just signifiers over there. Ive seen users here dunk on the concept of using "salt" to season your food, because "white people use salt." Same goes for herbs.
Whenever i talk to Americans and they talk about using spices, they can't ever specify what fucking spices apart from "oh cajun mix from the local store" or the like. Maybe I'm lucky enough to see the words "paprika" or "cumin", but I've yet to see anything but blank stares when I ask what they use for their other dishes. It's all the same fucking spices on all dishes, because it is not actually about making good food. Like the kings of old, spices are used as a signifyer rather than something that should be understood and used in cooking.
Your hot sauces suck ass too. I don't want some garbage artificial chemical capsaicing booster pack, I want a fucking hot sauce.
And your portion sizes are fucked and don't even get me started on corn syrup.
Americans need to shut the fuck up about food.
All your dishes are German anyway.

[–] [email protected] 23 points 6 months ago* (last edited 6 months ago) (2 children)

It's all the same fucking spices on all dishes

Hear me out: garlic improves basically everything but sweet stuff. it should be in everything.

Your hot sauces suck ass too.

Okay, what are your recommendations, I'd love to compare with my spice cabinet full of only flavorful hot sauces that aren't chemical bullshit and see if there's anything new I should be adding to the collection.

[–] [email protected] 17 points 6 months ago* (last edited 6 months ago) (1 children)

Okay, what are your recommendation.

I don't have any. I live in a commune with an Ecuadorian chef who makes hot sauces for us, so I'm no longer subjected to all the weird supermarket shit. Move in with a Zapatista I guess.

Garlic.

Yes!

[–] [email protected] 13 points 6 months ago (3 children)

god damn i'm jealous. i have a handful of supermarket ones, but mostly it's stuff I've had to import from latin america or asia. hot sauce availability in canada is mid.

[–] [email protected] 10 points 6 months ago (1 children)

hot sauce availability in canada is mid.

:yea: I guess maybe go ask your local Latin American restaurant (if there is one) wether you can buy their sauce? Long shot I guess

[–] [email protected] 9 points 6 months ago* (last edited 6 months ago) (5 children)

I'm pretty sure it's fucking all tapatio lmao. On the better side of store bought, but I live in the tiniest province so availability of basically anything interesting is low and there are like 3 Latin American restaurants I don't have to take a ferry to another province to visit.

[–] [email protected] 7 points 6 months ago* (last edited 6 months ago)

I going to pour one out for you, rip

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[–] [email protected] 10 points 6 months ago

Hear me out: garlic improves basically everything but sweet stuff. it should be in everything.

Nearly all of Central Europe, Turkey and the Levant agree with you there. I do, too. Garlic is flavor town central.

[–] [email protected] 22 points 6 months ago (6 children)

As an Algerian, I see this bullshit way too much between us and Moroccans, Motherfuckers really believe that on the Oujda Tlemcen border people stop eating Harrira and Baghrir on the other side, sometimes it's funny everytime it's fucking annoying.

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[–] [email protected] 18 points 6 months ago* (last edited 6 months ago)

I guess this is some dumbass American thing I am not capable of understanding. You guys seem to suck at cooking, it seems like food is just signifiers over there. Ive seen users here dunk on the concept of using "salt" to season your food, because "white people use salt." Same goes for herbs.
Whenever i talk to Americans and they talk about using spices, they can't ever specify what fucking spices apart from "oh cajun mix from the local store" or the like. Maybe I'm lucky enough to see the words "paprika" or "cumin", but I've yet to see anything but blank stares when I ask what they use for their other dishes. It's all the same fucking spices on all dishes, because it is not actually about making good food. Like the kings of old, spices are used as a signifyer rather than something that should be understood and used in cooking.
Your hot sauces suck ass too. I don't want some garbage artificial chemical capsaicing booster pack, I want a fucking hot sauce.
And your portion sizes are fucked and don't even get me started on corn syrup.
Americans need to shut the fuck up about food.
All your dishes are German anyway.

New tagline dropped please mods

[–] [email protected] 18 points 6 months ago (1 children)

I'm a food scholar by training (and I'm working to be a full-time food scholar, too) and you have largely summarized a bunch of conversations I've been in and books written on the whole "food is born out of migration, exchange, and local culture and biodiversity"

[–] [email protected] 10 points 6 months ago

Very cool!
I'll take that as a huge compliment, thank you. Is there any cool facts you feel like sharing, or corrections you'd like to make? I'd love to learn more. Do you have any books that you'd recommend a layperson?

[–] [email protected] 14 points 6 months ago (1 children)
[–] [email protected] 19 points 6 months ago* (last edited 6 months ago) (3 children)

Thank you. Ive taught a bunch of friends how to cook, (just the basics) and this mindset is one of many I have had to help alleviate them of.
You should cook food you like, and the primary indicator of when you've cooked "good food" is wether you like your food or not. This idea that certain things are taboo or wrong or that you have to enjoy certain dishes in certain ways, certain combinations or on certain occasions, only makes cooking more inapproachable. On top of that it is just weird ethno-nationalism when people insist only certain ethnicities are allowed to cook certain dishes, or that certain ethnicities are inherently bad at doing something or enjoying something.
Weirdly I only ever really see this from americans. They all like to point fingers at Italians, but all the Italians I've met have been chill as fuck about food - They understand that food is meant to bring people together, not tear them apart.
Americans are weird about food

[–] [email protected] 8 points 6 months ago

Still very much present in the EU as well, especially when it comes to French and Italian cooking (not necessarily from the French and Italians mind you)

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[–] [email protected] 9 points 6 months ago (3 children)

Even the shitty spices are mostly a hard on for (much better) French 19th century food. Early US and European food is 80% horseradish and peppercorn and whatever local spices were available.

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[–] [email protected] 57 points 6 months ago (7 children)

This is stupid. Tomatoes aren't native to India and chillies aren't native to China, doesn't mean those ingredients aren't legitimate to use in those cuisines. If you want to critique elitist European gastronomy then you should talk about how the French can't bear to eat anything that doesn't come from a dead animal or how elitist and condescending towards food from non-European cultures many Whites are.

[–] [email protected] 42 points 6 months ago (1 children)

Yeah I’m all for dunking on Europeans, but this is a dumb take, all food is from somewhere else. Apples may have come from Kazakhstan but that doesn’t mean people and cultures from outside Kazakhstan haven’t also grown apples and come up with unique ways to prepare and eat them. So what? Doesn’t mean a Japanese apple curry isn’t a part of Japanese cuisine, or cider isn’t a traditional beverage in south west England. Likewise with rice? Are we claiming that only food made near the Yangtze River basin can claim rice? Nigerian Jollof is rice apropriation?

Get outa here.

Dunk on Belgium for being allergic to flavour, or Germany for thinking chicken is a vegetable or Italians for being weird little freaks if you mess up a “traditional Italian recipe” when the only Italian food tradition for most of history was ‘not starving’.

[–] [email protected] 27 points 6 months ago (3 children)

Yeah this is silly. Cabbage is (as far as I can tell) native to Europe, but are we gonna pretend Kimchi is somehow not Korean?

[–] [email protected] 19 points 6 months ago (1 children)

Kimchi = Sauerkraut in a spicy hat and therefore kimchi is German. janet-wink

Don’t point out that sauerkraut has possible origins in China.

[–] [email protected] 9 points 6 months ago (1 children)

Neat! I didn't know sauerkraut had Chinese origins. Do you think both Kimchi and sauerkraut has some common Chinese dish as their ancestor?

[–] [email protected] 10 points 6 months ago (2 children)

They do! It's called suān cài, and uses chinese mustard in the south and west and napa cabbage in north china (this being the variety that sauerkraut is based on. Kimchi likely either shares its origin here as well or may have started as the same dish.

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[–] [email protected] 9 points 6 months ago (1 children)

I will stuff anyone that mocks kimchi into a stone urn and pickle them with enough salt and red pepper powder to kimchify them sour.

[–] [email protected] 8 points 6 months ago (2 children)

You are only allowed to do this if you're European, per hexbear rules. Sorry.

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[–] [email protected] 38 points 6 months ago (5 children)

new rule: you're only allowed to eat and cultivate what was where you live in 10000 bce smuglord we're uhhh deconstructing imperialism

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[–] [email protected] 31 points 6 months ago (1 children)

Also it's very entertaining to hear people talk about precious Italian cultural foods that are only 100 years old or so. Tomatoes weren't really used widely outside of LatAm until the mid-1800s. Bolognese sauce didn't have tomato until the 20th century. Same story for very popular Indian dishes like dal makhani.

People pining after the old traditional days of Italian grannies making tomato sauce is actually looking back at a very short history.

[–] [email protected] 15 points 6 months ago (1 children)

Pizza was unheard of in north Italy before ww2.

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[–] [email protected] 24 points 6 months ago (2 children)

Yeah, finding out bell peppers and tomatoes were native to the Americas I was like what the hell did Italians eat before this? AyyyyyOC-big anti-italian-discrimination

[–] [email protected] 11 points 6 months ago

They ate wheat polenta, I guess, and some uh, manakesh-looking food...

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[–] [email protected] 24 points 6 months ago
[–] [email protected] 21 points 6 months ago

There's a restaurant in Minneapolis called Owamni that uses only pre-Colombian ingredients native to the Americas. The chef is native.

Anyway the food is incredible and the concept is incredibly interesting.

[–] [email protected] 15 points 6 months ago (1 children)
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[–] [email protected] 13 points 6 months ago
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[–] [email protected] 11 points 6 months ago (1 children)

Coca-Cola? I thought that was from Atlanta. The kola nut is native to Africa, but coca is from South America

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[–] [email protected] 9 points 6 months ago

Don't forget all citrus from east Asia and all peppers from central and south america

[–] [email protected] 9 points 6 months ago (4 children)

So what foods are indigenous to europe?

Olives?

What else? I think sheep maybe? Idk.

[–] [email protected] 10 points 6 months ago* (last edited 6 months ago) (5 children)

https://www2.nau.edu/lrm22/lessons/plant_origins/plant_origins.html

Herring, types of cod, types of deer I reckon, types of cheese, cabbage, some other root vegetables I think. Maybe pig is allowed since it's probably from the Eurasian steppe (according to the first article on Google I found)?
It's not a lot since we've decided to go with the ethnonationalist definition of Europe as being "England, scandinavia, Germany, most of France, bits of Italy and the north of Spain" which doesn't really describe a large geographical area. It's also a definition thats mainly held by white supremacists.

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[–] [email protected] 7 points 6 months ago (2 children)

Dill
Fermented Shark
Mustard

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[–] [email protected] 9 points 6 months ago (2 children)

Pre-Colombian expansion food is honestly a fun subject, whether in the Americas side, or in Europe.

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