this post was submitted on 20 May 2024
998 points (98.3% liked)

World News

38255 readers
2450 users here now

A community for discussing events around the World

Rules:

We ask that the users report any comment or post that violate the rules, to use critical thinking when reading, posting or commenting. Users that post off-topic spam, advocate violence, have multiple comments or posts removed, weaponize reports or violate the code of conduct will be banned.

All posts and comments will be reviewed on a case-by-case basis. This means that some content that violates the rules may be allowed, while other content that does not violate the rules may be removed. The moderators retain the right to remove any content and ban users.


Lemmy World Partners

News [email protected]

Politics [email protected]

World Politics [email protected]


Recommendations

For Firefox users, there is media bias / propaganda / fact check plugin.

https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/media-bias-fact-check/

founded 1 year ago
MODERATORS
top 50 comments
sorted by: hot top controversial new old
[–] [email protected] 254 points 3 months ago (8 children)

Putting out arrest warrants on both of them is so smart. It's a way to avoid people claiming they are taking sides or playing favorites or aiding terrorists or being in favor of genocide or whatever. Both leaders are culpable because both the IDF and Hamas have committed atrocities.

[–] [email protected] 193 points 3 months ago (1 children)

It is a politically savvy and ethically correct move. Really nice when those line up.

[–] [email protected] 40 points 3 months ago

There's something satisfying about it.

[–] [email protected] 46 points 3 months ago (2 children)

At least the ICC is willing to do the right thing.

load more comments (2 replies)
[–] [email protected] 27 points 3 months ago* (last edited 3 months ago)

Putting out arrest warrants on both of them is so smart. It’s a way to avoid people claiming they are taking sides or playing favorites or aiding terrorists or being in favor of genocide or whatever.

It would be absurd and unjust to issue a warrant for only one of them. This was the right thing to do.

load more comments (5 replies)
[–] [email protected] 201 points 3 months ago (4 children)

The CNN headline is a bit misleading. It's not the International Criminal Court as a whole that is seeking these arrest warrants but the ICC's chief prosecutor Karim Khan. The judges have yet to decide on these warrants.

[Side note: This is the same kind of lazy journalism that uses terms like EU chief or EU leader interchangeably for the President of the European Commission (Ursula von der Leyen) and the President of the European Council (Charles Michel). If this was limited to a short headline, I could excuse it, but CNN continues with the same wording in the first sentence of the article: "The International Criminal Court is seeking arrest warrants for ..." which is absolutely unnecessary, even if CNN clarifies things later.]

[–] [email protected] 75 points 3 months ago* (last edited 3 months ago)

I've always considered CNN to stand for Clearly Not News

Edit - the BBC headline starts "ICC prosecutor seeks arrest of..."

https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/c3ggpe3qj6wo

[–] [email protected] 21 points 3 months ago* (last edited 3 months ago) (1 children)

Ok, this is very interesting. How is it he took this initiative? Actually, is it an initiative or part of the process?

[–] [email protected] 42 points 3 months ago (7 children)

It's part of the process. Now the request is before judges who will decide whether or not to issue the arrest warrants. For reference, when an ICC prosecutor asked for an arrest warrant for Vladmir Putin, it took a couple months for the judges to decide and then issue the warrant.

load more comments (7 replies)
load more comments (2 replies)
[–] [email protected] 68 points 3 months ago (1 children)

Biden can't save him, because we wouldn't agree to the Rome act because we thought that somehow meant we couldn't be charged at the Hauge for our war crimes. That's not true tho, we don't have to agree to it.

Israel and the United States are not members of the ICC. However, the ICC claims to have jurisdiction over Gaza, East Jerusalem and the West Bank after Palestinian leaders formally agreed to be bound by the court’s founding principles in 2015.

[–] [email protected] 16 points 3 months ago (10 children)

I mean… yes you do, since that’s a little bit how international law works? Countries who do not sign and ratify the Rome statute and then remain in there aren’t governed by the ICC in the same way.

You will see in the excerpt you quoted, the reason the ICC believes it has jurisdiction is because of events taking place in Palestine, which has taken part in the Rome Statute previously.

And the United States has a law that says it will militarily invade The Hague if any US service member is arrested and held by the court. It came about along with all the other legislative bullshit in the years after 9/11/01. The US had previously been a founding member of the ICC, but withdrew for reasons of sovereignty.

[–] [email protected] 22 points 3 months ago (2 children)

Sovereignity, my ass. They just don't want war crimes committed by their own military investigated by an independent body.

[–] [email protected] 12 points 3 months ago

Correct.

That position and sovereignty are not mutually opposed, depending on the view you take towards international law.

load more comments (1 replies)
load more comments (9 replies)
[–] [email protected] 51 points 3 months ago (1 children)

Nice that they see the criminals on both sides.

[–] [email protected] 30 points 3 months ago (2 children)

Same side.

Hamas is almost totally funded by Benny and his croneys.

[–] [email protected] 15 points 3 months ago

Was I think, they stopped a few years ago.

load more comments (1 replies)
[–] [email protected] 47 points 3 months ago (3 children)

I'm not sure I understand how these warrants can take place. It will come from other member states in case any of them travel there?

Also how is it that Putin has not been arrested yet? Has he avoided those destinations.

If I misunderstood something or everything, please let me know.

[–] [email protected] 94 points 3 months ago (1 children)

Yes, Putin has avoided those destinations so far. He even got warned by South Africa that they’d have to arrest him if he were to travel to a meeting there.

[–] [email protected] 20 points 3 months ago

Thank you for the clarification!

[–] [email protected] 43 points 3 months ago (2 children)

They can't make a country arrest it's own leader.

But if they travel to any UN country, the country is supposed to arrest them, or coordinate with countries willing to.

So these are more like an exile than anything.

Kind of like a sanction but instead of money it's on personal travel.

Sanctions are still waaaaaay more effective though and what we should be doing. Money is what these despots care about.

[–] [email protected] 16 points 3 months ago (1 children)

so this also means that if netanyahu loses elections, he can be just sent to hague

[–] [email protected] 33 points 3 months ago (1 children)

If the person who beats him wants too...

And if Netenyahu even lets Israel have elections. Before 10/7 he was already in the process of getting kicked out of office, the only reason he's still in power is 10/7.

load more comments (1 replies)
load more comments (1 replies)
load more comments (1 replies)
[–] [email protected] 46 points 3 months ago* (last edited 3 months ago) (2 children)

Good, this is a situation in which both sides are both truly disgusting and vile, using people as pawns, shields, etc.

[–] [email protected] 12 points 3 months ago (4 children)

Yeah, for some reason too many people are having difficulty understanding that in this case, yes, the both side argument works quite well. Both Hamas and the Israeli government are horrible with the citizens on both side suffering

load more comments (4 replies)
load more comments (1 replies)
[–] [email protected] 39 points 3 months ago

Regardless of the technicalities and nuances in the reporting: this is a good thing.

[–] [email protected] 35 points 3 months ago (3 children)

Can we talk about a story that's fallen through the cracks here? CNN claiming this as an exclusive is madness. Who do these people think they are? And should the ICC issue arrest warrants about it? 😉

[–] [email protected] 13 points 3 months ago (2 children)

CNN claiming this as an exclusive is madness

That's an excellent point you're making

load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (2 replies)
[–] [email protected] 26 points 3 months ago

More links

https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/c3ggpe3qj6wo

https://apnews.com/article/icc-khan-netanyahu-070941d21ccd1f2b9611032b88527575

Karim Khan said that he believes Netanyahu, his defense minister Yoav Gallant and three Hamas leaders — Yehia Sinwar, Mohammed Deif and Ismail Haniyeh — are responsible for war crimes and crimes against humanity in the Gaza Strip and Israel.

The prosecutor must request the warrants from a pre-trial panel of three judges, who take on average two months to consider the evidence and determine if the proceedings can move forward.

Israel is not a member of the court, and even if the arrest warrants are issued, Netanyahu and Gallant do not face any immediate risk of prosecution. But Khan’s announcement deepens Israel’s isolation as it presses ahead with its war, and the threat of arrest could make it difficult for the Israeli leaders to travel abroad.

Both Sinwar and Deif are believed to be hiding in Gaza as Israel tries to hunt them down. But Haniyeh, the supreme leader of the Islamic militant group, is based in Qatar and frequently travels across the region.

[–] [email protected] 25 points 3 months ago (2 children)

Let's check what the left wing "progressive" israelis think about this.

[–] [email protected] 19 points 3 months ago

It's not comparing them, they have just all went over the bar for being war criminals.

[–] [email protected] 14 points 3 months ago

Herein lies one of the innumerable differences between democratic socialists and liberals

[–] [email protected] 22 points 3 months ago (6 children)

Fucking hell got so confused by the title, was wondering what the fuck do these guys have to do with cricket.

load more comments (6 replies)
[–] [email protected] 21 points 3 months ago (1 children)

They've already called it antisemitic.

load more comments (1 replies)
[–] [email protected] 19 points 3 months ago

You mean "they did it first" doesn't hold up in international court?

[–] [email protected] 17 points 3 months ago (6 children)

“Let me be clear,” the president said in the statement, “whatever this prosecutor might imply, there is no equivalence – none – between Israel and Hamas.”

Biden saying the right things as usual. /s

[–] [email protected] 16 points 3 months ago

It's true. Hamas is posting rookie numbers. They've got to up their death count by around 10x before they can be in Israel's league.

load more comments (5 replies)
load more comments
view more: next ›